urbanMSP

It looks like Dunn Brothers closed at least one other shop abruptly. Are they in trouble?

Where is the other closure? I had a feeling the one in the library would close. I used to volunteer there and there was definitely an unsafe and hostile feeling there and around the building. Not to say that's a justified or correct feeling, but it was the feeling me and others I would volunteer with would get. Seems for a coffee shop to be successful you'd want a space where people could be comfortable, not afraid of being disturbed and can leave their laptop on the table when they go to the bathroom - this space did not elicit those feelings for me. I love Dunn Brother's coffee and hope the best for Nicollet because I actually quite enjoy the progress I've seen there and now spend quite a bit of time at Brits, the Local, Barrio and Peavey Plaza. Seems like as of now there's more hope for the south end of the mall, and we've got some major steps to take on the north end.

They're a franchise, so a local operator with multiple stores could be having difficulty, but it doesn't necessarily mean that Dunn Bros itself is in trouble.

I used to volunteer there and there was definitely an unsafe and hostile feeling there and around the building

So the one in Uptown closed. Look I went here when I was fresh 18 just graduated from a high school in the burbs. It did not feel hostile to me. Unsafe? Maybe? Are you associated with the people who are outside the building? If not then it's not even likely they'll interact with you. Either way it's a coffee shop that's open in broad daylight on a major pedestrian corridor with security and police hanging around all the time. I'm kind of getting tired of seeing this rhetoric used on the forum. It's very thinly veiled racism and classism that shouldn't be said in almost every thread about Nicollet Mall. We have an institutional problem with the way we treat people in this country, so they're going to be visible somewhere.

The Dunn Bros in Metro Lofts adjacent to the Westgate LRT station closed under kind of random circumstances last year too. As far as I know it’s still empty.

Ditto for Dunn Bros in LaSalle Plaza.

I used to volunteer there and there was definitely an unsafe and hostile feeling there and around the building

So the one in Uptown closed. Look I went here when I was fresh 18 just graduated from a high school in the burbs. It did not feel hostile to me. Unsafe? Maybe? Are you associated with the people who are outside the building? If not then it's not even likely they'll interact with you. Either way it's a coffee shop that's open in broad daylight on a major pedestrian corridor with security and police hanging around all the time. I'm kind of getting tired of seeing this rhetoric used on the forum. It's very thinly veiled racism and classism that shouldn't be said in almost every thread about Nicollet Mall. We have an institutional problem with the way we treat people in this country, so they're going to be visible somewhere.

I get that. I have felt that as well. However, I actually thought the post that you referenced was very vulnerably said, a way of communicating I would like to encourage. If you feel comfortable doing so, I’d love to hear your thoughts on how to wed the sometimes conflicting goals of giving people a space to be honest, but also checking veiled racist/classist comments. So as not to take the thread further off topic, please hit me up with an IM. All good what ever you decide. Thanks

So as not to take the thread further off topic, please hit me up with an IM. All good what ever you decide. Thanks

Someone can delete this post as I know it's annoyingly long and off topic. I'll leave this here for the time being, but I feel some need to defend myself and those who attempt to express nuanced positions on here.

I don't think it's productive to throw out terms like racist/classist because that inevitably ends a conversation. Look - I think most of us are on the same side here (liberal, progressive, looking to make our city and the world a better place for all, not just upper middle class white millennials) that's why I was volunteering there and Franklin Library teaching first generation immigrants to read, write, basic math skills and to help them study for their citizenship tests.

Do we want Nicollet to be the beating heart of downtown Minneapolis, and a shopping, dining, and retail destination? A destination that would ensure that a coffee shop would have no problem staying in business, or ground floor retail in new apartments would fill up immediately? I think most would say yes.

Do we want to help those who have been left behind by a society that views them as a burden and not people? Do we want to try and give these people opportunities to improve themselves who were unlucky enough to get pushed aside or forgotten about by a system designed to not give them a fighting chance? Most would say yes.

Are these two things mutually exclusive? In a perfect world, no and maybe not in this world either. All I know is my social network mostly avoids this part of the mall because of the feelings I stated in my previous post. Maybe their feelings are unjustified and simply a product of underlying biases that they themselves can't recognize. Maybe it's because of several experiences in which they were justifiably made to feel uncomfortable or unsafe. Just as the poor and left behind have a right to any public space, is it right for them to make it into an uncomfortable space for young women and the elderly to enjoy, so they just avoid it? I believe it's a discussion worth having without resorting to claims of racism. Maybe I'm wrong.

Do we want Nicollet to be the beating heart of downtown Minneapolis, and a shopping, dining, and retail destination?

Yes and no. If "destination" means "where people come from the suburbs twice a year for dinner" then no that isn't the goal. I want Nicollet to be part of a thriving downtown, with well-used retail and services that meet the needs of people who live and work downtown. Once it can do that it will also attract others, but we can't focus on the others without undermining the needs of people who are already there. Especially those who are already there who we think might scare off the suburbanites.

Cities have panhandlers and people experiencing homeless or otherwise hanging out on the street. We can try to manage behaviors, but we can't make them go away, as decades of making out outdoor environment hostile to spend time in demonstrated.

To go back specifically to Nimbus, it's been gated off for weeks. I don't know if the "closed for maintenance" sign is still there, but it seems like it's actually closed to keep the "wrong" people out. That's a poor solution (and no, I can't say for what a viable/funded alternative is other than just tolerating the presence of who ever shows up and behaves acceptably).

I believe it's a discussion worth having without resorting to claims of racism. Maybe I'm wrong.

I'm going mostly leave this alone, because it's way off topic, but I would definitely recommend the book White Fragility: https://www.newyorker.com/books/page-tu ... ing-racism

Also, Betsy Hodges agrees with you (I think) in a recent podcast on this topic: https://crooked.com/podcast/real-friend ... sy-hodges/

I think Mayor Frey has made some progress to making housing more widely available with the granny flat laws and increasing building codes for density. However we still got a long ways to go. Drug addicts and uneducated people is not who I wan't to sit by outside during my lunch meal break for obvious reasons.

We need community police, not police driving by the community chasing cars around. We need police willing to stop to talk to these people and help them connect the dots in there life and get the resources they need, we need police where they are more involved in the community so people can give them better information. I mean I can't call 911 to pass along the information of what is going on in my community, nor can I yell it to the cop driving by with his windows rolled up. I have seen Metro Transit posting on social media about they are creating a new taskforce to help with homeless so that is a step forward indeed.

We need to change society and that takes a great deal of time, so for the short term I think we need police officers walking the streets ASAP talking to these people and helping them get rides and get to places where they can get there life back on track. These services DO already exist! Not sure if they are still overwhelmed or just not being taken advantage of. A few years ago I had a guy trying to sell me his hot meal from a soup kitchen around the Greyhound bus station. It was sad, but drug addiction is real. We can't always afford to waste so many resources on people not wanting to take them seriously.

If I had a billion dollars I would open a education center & homeless shelter where I would offer programs to educate people, and help them get back on track. Saddly those services are not what is really needed, it's the old mental instantiations that is needed. Our society would be better of bringing them back, if only they could ACTUALLY treat them humanly. Something that can happen. I had a family member that was on one of them and was treated very well, but couldn't take care of himself so that was the best option. Instead many of those types of people are left to fend for themselves turning to drugs and other options because they are just not able to navigate the real world like normal able minded people. Might sound blut and to the point but, im not trying to sugar coat it. Until we fix that problem homelessness is always going to be an issue we will never be able to overcome. Free medicare for all would also take a big bite out of it by getting meds to people who could then live productive lives with a helping hand back up, but until we actually address the really mentally ill then there is always going to be homelessness.

As it relates to nicollet mall once cops start kicking them out it will help retail a bit, but unless we actually fix the problems it's just a band-aid as we all know they are going to be moving back in come spring.

Are the DID ambassadors trained in connecting people to services? That may be another way to help out as they are easily identifiable, and are already walking around downtown.

A Madewell denim shop is coming to the North Loop next to the Lululemon. (unlocked)

Looks like the North Loop is starting to hit its stride. Hopefully more boutique and home grown brands will be able to make a name for themselves along side these new major retailers coming into the area. It’s that sort of mix that’ll keep the area fresh.