Vikings Stadium Miscellaneous Discussion

Downtown - North Loop - Mill District - Elliot Park - Loring Park
Didier
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Re: Vikings Stadium

Postby Didier » August 15th, 2013, 8:33 am

We can argue in the weeds, the point is there are many, many events being held in the new stadium for which the people who profit off them could have been partners with the Wilfs/Vikings. The fact that stadiums as high-end as the ones currently being erected cannot be fully paid for, even after the NFL "loan," without public subsidy is proof that the value in the price tag is not worthwhile to Vikings fans or other sport/concert/show goers. (That, or the NFL owners outside of Atlanta are really good at convincing the public to pay a larger share than is necessary for the stadium to be financially viable).
Who says NFL stadiums can't be built without public subsidy? Of course they could.

Public money is involved because sports teams have created that precedent over many years. And because public money has allowed teams to build nicer stadiums than they could have built privately, the standard for stadiums is now higher than the market value. The Vikings could have put together a new field and four sets of bleachers for $500 million, but without the public subsidy it would not be competitive in today's NFL.

It's a vicious cycle, and fixing it has to come at the national level, not some pipe dream that a non-existent MLS team and a monster truck promoter will step up to make up the difference.

MNdible
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Re: Vikings Stadium

Postby MNdible » August 21st, 2013, 12:32 pm

I think it's safe to assume that we all saw this coming, right?

Property owner Minneapolis Venture LLC filed suit late Tuesday in Hennepin County District Court against the Minnesota Sports Facilities Authority, claiming that negotiations over the land next to the stadium site have been “perplexing and unproductive.” The suit seeks clarity from a judge on whether the above-ground plaza and its coveted underground parking garage are part of the massive stadium’s reach...

But the land owned by Minneapolis Venture on the eastern edge of downtown, bordered by Park Avenue S. and Kirby Puckett Place between 4th and 5th streets, is a key piece in the development of the stadium’s expansive environs.

Architectural renderings of the glassy sports facility depict the light-rail stop and a plaza on the property that Minneapolis Venture purchased from the city of Minneapolis in 2007, part of a $65 million deal that included five parking ramps. And the 455 parking stalls beneath the Downtown East plot are critical for the authority to control in order to meet a legislative mandate to provide 2,500 parking spots in proximity to the stadium.

min-chi-cbus
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Re: Vikings Stadium

Postby min-chi-cbus » August 21st, 2013, 3:39 pm

I'm so confused.....did ANYBODY do their due dilligence when it came to both the Vikings Stadium and the SW Corridor projects? It's like you'd think these problems would have been vetted out naturally by the pre-approval process and whatnot.

lordmoke
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Re: Vikings Stadium

Postby lordmoke » August 21st, 2013, 3:55 pm

I'm not really sure what the issue here is? Nothing I have seen relating to the stadium itself does anything to address the light rail parcel. The stadium redevelopment stops at Chicago, no? It doesn't appear that he's talking about the Ryan development, which actually looks like it would include his land, so I'm very confused here. If I'm missing something, please let me know!

MNdible
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Re: Vikings Stadium

Postby MNdible » August 21st, 2013, 3:58 pm

A private property owner trying to milk the government for every last dime because they know they have them over a barrel?

This may not be the first time this has happened.

But I do remembering thinking to myself, when the city was getting ready to sell off their stable of parking garages not too long ago, that they may have wanted to hold onto this particular one a bit longer.

MNdible
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Re: Vikings Stadium

Postby MNdible » August 21st, 2013, 4:02 pm

Nothing I have seen relating to the stadium itself does anything to address the light rail parcel.
I was just thinking about the parcel yesterday when I was looking at the Stadium site plans that are under review right now. This parcel is indicated as being within the Stadium improvement zone, and yet there were absolutely no improvements indicated as being made to it.

Somewhat related, the stub of 5th Street that runs through this block, and which will soon serve absolutely no function whatsoever, is still shown to remain in place.

Tom H.
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Re: Vikings Stadium

Postby Tom H. » August 22nd, 2013, 9:24 am

A private property owner trying to milk the government for every last dime because they know they have them over a barrel?

This may not be the first time this has happened.
The exact same thing happened before the construction of Target Field, when the owners of the Rapid Park lots on which the stadium was going to be built jacked up the price of their parcel once the legislation was signed.

Rich
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Re: Vikings Stadium

Postby Rich » August 22nd, 2013, 9:58 am

The difference is that while this parcel is within the overall project boundary, it isn't part of the stadium grounds. Stadium construction will proceed even if nothing is resolved, so Mpls Venture has less leverage. The MSFA won't necessarily be in a hurry to make a deal.

nordeast homer
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Re: Vikings Stadium

Postby nordeast homer » August 22nd, 2013, 10:07 am

From what I understand with the lawsuit, it's not whether or not they will sell, they just want a judge to tell them what fair price is, correct?
It didn't sound like this should hold anything up.

m b p
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Re: Vikings Stadium

Postby m b p » August 23rd, 2013, 12:19 am

I've been working on a google earth model of the new stadium. There are a lot of weird angles. It was a lot more difficult than drawing a shape and extending that shape upward so many feet (like a tower... drawing a square floor... and stacking them on top of themselves so many feet... nic on 5th). Because of that it's nowhere near perfect... but it's almost a good representation of what it will look like. :) Anyway... here you go:

http://sketchup.google.com/3dwarehouse/ ... 45&ct=mdsa

The model seems to have issues in google earth... causing it to crash every once in a while. I'm not sure how to fix that. Slow and deliberate movements, in google earth, seem to limit the crashing.

Image
(yes... the ryan project is pictured as well)

m b p
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Re: Vikings Stadium

Postby m b p » August 23rd, 2013, 1:29 am

I know we all talked about 272' being huge... but... it really is.
Image
(35w looking N)

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Nathan
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Re: Vikings Stadium

Postby Nathan » August 23rd, 2013, 10:52 am

Whoa... Monster!!! It kinda looks cool, like it's pointing to Down Town... If Elliot park develops, it might not be so visible, what was it like from the river?

RailBaronYarr
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Re: Vikings Stadium

Postby RailBaronYarr » August 26th, 2013, 10:58 am


lordmoke
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Re: Vikings Stadium

Postby lordmoke » August 27th, 2013, 1:25 pm


talindsay
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Re: Vikings Stadium

Postby talindsay » August 27th, 2013, 1:28 pm

The word is "Quixotic".

nordeast homer
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Re: Vikings Stadium

Postby nordeast homer » August 27th, 2013, 2:37 pm

Glad I'm not his neighbor. Seems like the type that would sue you because your tree dropped leaves on his lawn.

min-chi-cbus
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Re: Vikings Stadium

Postby min-chi-cbus » August 27th, 2013, 3:41 pm

Probably a 6th District resident...

Unity77
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Re: Vikings Stadium

Postby Unity77 » August 30th, 2013, 1:10 pm

I think it's safe to assume that we all saw this coming, right?

Property owner Minneapolis Venture LLC filed suit late Tuesday in Hennepin County District Court against the Minnesota Sports Facilities Authority, claiming that negotiations over the land next to the stadium site have been “perplexing and unproductive.” The suit seeks clarity from a judge on whether the above-ground plaza and its coveted underground parking garage are part of the massive stadium’s reach...

But the land owned by Minneapolis Venture on the eastern edge of downtown, bordered by Park Avenue S. and Kirby Puckett Place between 4th and 5th streets, is a key piece in the development of the stadium’s expansive environs.

Architectural renderings of the glassy sports facility depict the light-rail stop and a plaza on the property that Minneapolis Venture purchased from the city of Minneapolis in 2007, part of a $65 million deal that included five parking ramps. And the 455 parking stalls beneath the Downtown East plot are critical for the authority to control in order to meet a legislative mandate to provide 2,500 parking spots in proximity to the stadium.
According to the Business Journal, "Minneapolis Venture valued the plaza property between $24 million and $26 million. The tax-assessed value of the property was $4.5 million in 2011."

Also, here is a rendering of what Minneapolis Venture had proposed for the plaza.
Image

twincitizen
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Re: Vikings Stadium

Postby twincitizen » August 30th, 2013, 1:35 pm

Maybe they should have built something in the 6 years they've owned the property and we wouldn't be having this conversation today...

I know, I know, recession, etc. But still... Bob Lux needs to shit or get off the pot, when it comes to his downtown property holdings. If you're not going to do anything this decade, sell it to someone who will *cough* Block E *cough*

nordeast homer
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Re: Vikings Stadium

Postby nordeast homer » August 30th, 2013, 1:37 pm

I believe they were going to build something here as much as I believe that construction is imminent on their 10th and Hennepin site. (Wasn't something promised there about 8-9 years ago). The headway they've made on Block E is another great example of how they drag their feet. I'm still not sure how they ever got the Carlyle out of the ground!
Last edited by nordeast homer on August 30th, 2013, 9:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.


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