The Eclipse

[kregger22]

While it is somewhat nice to have a 20 story tower proposed, it's frustrating to have another 20 story tower that is uninspiring proposed. Anyone who likes tall buildings has had NOTHING to get REALLY excited about except for LPM (for the most part) in the last decade. I know all the reasons why not to do 1 tall tower as opposed to 2 shorter ones, and we need to hold on to our seat and be patient for something taller to go up - but here is a chance to make a statement with a signature tower... going away again.

[Nick]

Who's holding you back?

[FISHMANPET]

I love this idea that there's some secret cabal that decides how tall buildings should be and wear they should be built, and their decisions have no basis in economic reality, or any reality at all for that matter.

Or, Jim Stanton owns this land and this is what he can afford/finance to build. Which happens to be the case for all the buildings being built. It's not like these developers have never seen a building taller than 20 stories and thus are completely incapable of imagining anything taller. This is what he can afford to build, so this is what he builds.

[John]

The height isn't the problem with this proposal IMO, its just too massive looking. There's no sense of scale or proportion and doesn't take any cues from the surrounding area to give it context. It's basically an overblown and bad version of the better designed Stonebridge. That said , I think with some revision to the exterior it could work pretty well and be a good development. I hope someone speaks up in the planning commission.

[City slicker]

I like buildings of all heights and I especially appreciate unique architectural designs. However, one can't deny that Minneapolis is "height shy" when it comes to new construction. It seems every project gets chopped down to from it's original proposal or limited to a certain height. Everything from the Capella tower to the Wells Fargo tower, to the now nic on fifth down six floors, LPM down two floors, the new Ryan proposal from 20-17, ect ect ect. Not to mention nothing surpassing the IDS in height. I'm wondering if other cities have this issue and to this degree. Is it all coincidence? Was not the original eclipse 30 some floors and much better looking? I don't totally remember..

[thatchio]

Recommendation: if you edit someone's drawing (which I'm sure they'd do appreciate), make it clear on the image itself that it is a modified image and not representative of the actual proposal. It could be very confusing to people who just skim and potentially react to that.

[Chauncey87]

I for one really enjoy the look of the proposed tower(s). The bold dark almost night shade hues mixed in with golden vertical lines makes this building something I don't think is something Minneapolis has ever seen on such a large scale. The massing really brings a dominating presence to what is currently around it and with out a doubt will have people do a double take as they take in what they are seeing. The urban canyon this building will help expand is really something I enjoy feeling when I am walking down the street.

On a side note I remember a two building complex proposed for this very sight that was in the mid 30 floor range give or take. That was years and years ago and so was the whole foods tower. Unless myself and anybody else reading this has a spare 100+ million in cash to toss around and build the Eclipse that was proposed years ago then pining about what could have been is not productive. It is still January and already Minneapolis is building a 30 floor apt tower right next to the Nic and this being proposed today is a really big deal. So cheer up I feel like some of you are starting to get early signs of cabin fever.

[talindsay]

On a side note I remember a two building complex proposed for this very sight that was in the mid 30 floor range give or take. That was years and years ago and so was the whole foods tower. Unless myself and anybody else reading this has a spare 100+ million in cash to toss around and build the Eclipse that was proposed years ago then pining about what could have been is not productive. It is still January and already Minneapolis is building a 30 floor apt tower right next to the Nic and this being proposed today is a really big deal. So cheer up I feel like some of you are starting to get early signs of cabin fever.

Nicely expressed side note! One can be upset that builders aren't playing SimCity but are actually playing with real money in real companies, but it's pretty amazing how much *is* going up right now.

[m b p]

Google Earth model for Eclipse (Towers 1 and 2):
http://sketchup.google.com/3dwarehouse/ ... 5&result=4

[bapster2006]

Here you go rookies. The original proposal from 2006.

Eclipse proposal 2006 rendering 3 by bapster2006, on Flickr


Eclipse proposal 2006 rendering 1 by bapster2006, on Flickr

[Wedgeguy]

I much prefer this coloration and lack of the boxiness to the current model. IMO this is a classy building similar to the LPM Tower. I'd say the curved units are more oriented towards the falls. Thanks you Bapster for a chance at a comparison.

[Anondson]

The curved side also aligns windows nicely towards the Gateway park across Hennepin.

[min-chi-cbus]

But also on the heating bill in the cold months. And we have more cold months than warm ones. According to Wikipedia (yeah, I know), only 5 of 12 months have an average high above 60, while fully 10 of 12 months have an average low below 60; all twelve months have an average low below 65.

Sure, but 7 of 12 months average over 58, which is climactically similar to 60, so one can word it differently depending on the point being made.

[TommyT]

The original render is gorgeous! It's really too bad they've gone a different direction. Is there any possibility they would go back toward something like that at this point or is it too late with the new renders already drawn up?

[5th Ave Guy]

I do like how the old curved design would have allowed for better street presence on Wash / Henn. That could be a pretty cool corner with more space there.

[bubzki2]

Pardon my ignorance, but what are the realistic chances we see the newly-proposed design get some tweaks? Especially regarding massing and crown? I like it, but I'm just curious if there's a chance they'll refine it before approval?

[Avian]

One unusual thing about the renderings is that they are virtually black & white. About the only hint of color is the beige masonry ribbons. While Stanton used dark glass on Stonebridge (and will likely use it here too) I find it interesting that the renderings are monochromatic - as if to say that final colors have not yet been chosen. The buildings may not end up being as hulking as they are shown here.

[talindsay]

But also on the heating bill in the cold months. And we have more cold months than warm ones. According to Wikipedia (yeah, I know), only 5 of 12 months have an average high above 60, while fully 10 of 12 months have an average low below 60; all twelve months have an average low below 65.

Sure, but 7 of 12 months average over 58, which is climatically similar to 60, so one can word it differently depending on the point being made.

Obviously I chose a cutoff temp somewhat arbitrarily but I chose it based on the fact that most spaces are kept ~70 degrees so an exterior temp in the 60s usually requires air conditioning while a temp in the 50s usually requires heating. Note that with your arbitrary shift to 58 you still have 9 months with an average low below that, and only 7 with an average high above it, so even with that as the threshold heating would be the bigger deal. Even all the way down at 42 degrees, we still only have 7 months with average highs above and 7 months with average lows below. My specific number was somewhat arbitrarily chosen to give a nice cushion below the typical indoor temperature, but no matter how you slice it Minneapolis is cold - we heat way more than we cool, which anybody who owns a house can attest to. If you forget to put your electric bill on a budget plan you'll have a slightly unpleasant July and August electric bill; if you forget to put your gas bill on a budget plan you'll be panicking come January.

Using daily average mean temperatures from weather.com and taking 68 F (20C) as "average" room temperature, there's a total of 8229 negative degree-days (degrees variance each day summed where temperature is below room temp), compared to only 330 positive degree-days (same, where temperature is above room temp). Change that room temperature number to a chilly 58 and it's still 5662 negative degree-days versus 1413 positive. To get the total to balance (where negative equals positive) one has to go all the way down to 46.5 degrees.

[Minneboy]

Don't know about anyone else but I don't even want to talk about temperatures until maybe April. Thank you.

[John]

One unusual thing about the renderings is that they are virtually black & white. About the only hint of color is the beige masonry ribbons. While Stanton used dark glass on Stonebridge (and will likely use it here too) I find it interesting that the renderings are monochromatic - as if to say that final colors have not yet been chosen. The buildings may not end up being as hulking as they are shown here.

I hope your are right. And historically, the "phase two" of so many project proposals never get off the ground. That parcel can be sold to another developer at a future time, so we only have to deal with the blight of one "hulking" building. Stanton wants the unit to car stall ratio increased or he's threatening to nix the project. That may be difficult for the green conscious planning commission to swallow. Interesting how the Chicago based Magellan LPM project has such a small unit to car stall ratio and they were comfortable with that. Stanton' s stance on this issue reflects that backward and suburban attitude still so prevalent with many developers here.