Century Plaza / Convention Hotel rumoring (archive)

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TroyGBiv
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Re: Convention Center Hotel - (330 South 12th Street)

Postby TroyGBiv » April 2nd, 2014, 8:57 pm

One of the solutions to this downtown concern would be to develop a mixed used hotel / condo / apartment complex. The monthly fees from rental and condos would help to cover a lot of the regular operations of the complex. This is really much more common in asia, the middle east and in urban tourist destinations. Could make a more striking impact on our skyline as well.

min-chi-cbus
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Re: Convention Center Hotel - (330 South 12th Street)

Postby min-chi-cbus » April 3rd, 2014, 8:32 am

It also sends the message we're willing to give private developers access to the city coffers
If the hotel is built on the county land and they offer any kind of TIF money there should really be no money coming from the city. Unless I am misunderstanding things, the county is not paying any taxes on the land right now, so we wouldn't be losing any revenue per se.
The city has done some stupid things with money in the past, (Block E, Conservatory), but I think this could be a good thing for the city. If Indianapolis can make itself a destination for events, there's no reason Minneapolis can't, and this would go a long ways to promoting that.
Just so you know, other cities are doing the same thing, and everyone's going to end up competiting for the same slice of pie.....just with a bigger fork. I'm in Cleveland now and Cleveland is in the midst of putting together a near-convention sized hotel of 650 rooms, along with some other hotels. They just built this "Medical Mart" here, which is basically a convention center geared towards medical clientelle, specifically the Cleveland Clinic. So perhaps Cleveland has a niche that Minneapolis does not (despite the Mayo's presence not too far away), and it won't affect national convention demand quite the same. But my sense tells me that most cities are doing the same old cliche thing when it comes to being relevant and attracting more people to downtown:

1. building a downtown casino (or three)
2. expanding their convention centers
3. building one (or another) convention-sized hotel >1000 rooms
4. building a new stadium


I always viewed Minneapolis as a progressive place but lately it seems like more and more we are becoming yet another "wannabe" city with little vision and leadership. I'd much rather see something unique and first-of-its-kind from this city than more-of-the-same development, including this.

Tcmetro
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Re: Convention Center Hotel - (330 South 12th Street)

Postby Tcmetro » April 3rd, 2014, 8:34 am

Pretty much every city in the US is copying each other and all the true innovation in urban design is happening over in Europe. It's a shame we don't see better urban design practices out of Asia, but considering how new their cities are, they have a huge car culture.

Minneapolisite

Re: Convention Center Hotel - (330 South 12th Street)

Postby Minneapolisite » April 3rd, 2014, 7:21 pm

My hometown of Columbus is looking at proposals like this one to transform part of their fortress of a convention center into a 500 room hotel + 108 unit apartment building.

Image

credit: Wagenbrenner/Rockbridge

http://www.bizjournals.com/columbus/new ... l?page=all

This would abut the highway retail cap which hides the highway on both sides with restaurants and bars. Right now the convention center interacts with the street like this.

Image

credit: Analogue Kid

Ours doesn't fair much better (it's set way back too) and certainly pales in comparison to what's being proposed in Columbus in its current state. Maybe we don't need twice as any hotel rooms as Columbus, but it definitely needs a remake to offer a sidewalk experience similar to that of Nicollet Mall.

mattaudio
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Re: Convention Center Hotel - (330 South 12th Street)

Postby mattaudio » April 7th, 2014, 2:13 pm

One more example of how government-led buildings are the enemy of quality public space and activated sidewalks. Although we appear to be learning from a century of mistakes...

nickmgray
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Re: Convention Center Hotel - (330 South 12th Street)

Postby nickmgray » April 7th, 2014, 2:22 pm

Alternately, the city could offer up the 3rd ave side of the convention center to develop a hotel that's directly connected to the space. The 3rd ave side of the building it a blank wall that offer absolutely nothing. I could easily imagine a 25 floor hotel right there with a few small shop and restaurant with outdoor seating.

https://www.google.com/maps/@44.970258, ... ndgghg!2e0

mattaudio
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Re: Convention Center Hotel - (330 South 12th Street)

Postby mattaudio » April 7th, 2014, 2:26 pm

The crime about that side of the convention center is that it was built as an expansion about a decade ago. They moved the whole street, rebuilt the bridge over 94, and built a blank wall. All because a consultant said the convention center needed an addition in order to be competitive in the shrinking convention marketplace. Yet our convention center has done worse financially than before this expansion opens.

Keep that in mind when people say we need a convention hotel to be competitive. History repeats itself.

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Avian
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Re: Convention Center Hotel - (330 South 12th Street)

Postby Avian » April 7th, 2014, 2:37 pm

Alternately, the city could offer up the 3rd ave side of the convention center to develop a hotel that's directly connected to the space. The 3rd ave side of the building it a blank wall that offer absolutely nothing. I could easily imagine a 25 floor hotel right there with a few small shop and restaurant with outdoor seating.

https://www.google.com/maps/@44.970258, ... ndgghg!2e0
That side is where the auditorium is. If you "lose" that side for a hotel you lose the auditorium. And you lose the Whelan mural.

I'm not sure where the criticism of the Minneapolis Convention Center is coming from. It interacts very well with the street along its "front door" of 2nd Avenue and Grant Streets. It's much better than most other CC's in the US. Leonard Parker designed the public spaces pretty well. By the very nature of a convention center you're going to have some blank walls. Thankfully the MCC's blank walls are either hidden behind the church, set back from the street with a green buffer or front only one-block of 3rd Avenue.

“Wise men speak because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something.”
― Plato

mattaudio
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Re: Convention Center Hotel - (330 South 12th Street)

Postby mattaudio » April 7th, 2014, 3:01 pm

The Convention Center was built to "contain" downtown, just like the ABC ramps or the Haaf/GC/CenterVillage wall. Now that Downtown is busting out of its britches, it looks like a mistake. Why accept blank walls? We could instead have them ringed with mixed use. Look just a few blocks away at how the 110 Grant parking podium was screened... heck, doesn't Al Franken live in one of those townhomes?

mplsjaromir
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Re: Convention Center Hotel - (330 South 12th Street)

Postby mplsjaromir » April 7th, 2014, 4:27 pm

500 E Grant St is where Franken lives. I saw him in the parking garage a few times when I lived there.

John
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Re: Convention Center Hotel - (330 South 12th Street)

Postby John » April 7th, 2014, 4:30 pm

It's important to point out that values change over time. During the period when Leonard Parker designed both phase one and phase two of the Convention Center, it was lauded for its beautiful design and highly functional spaces. It was a vast improvement over the previous convention center which was even more of a fortress. I think Avian has it right with the "front door" of the complex which is well done, but I agree with Matt some of the blank walls (facing 3rd Ave and 1st Ave in particular) should interact better with the street. We are now in an era of urban planning where there's a better focus on reclaiming the city for pedestrian activity which I passionately support. At some point I do hope they add multi-use activity and open it up more.

MNdible
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Re: Convention Center Hotel - (330 South 12th Street)

Postby MNdible » October 3rd, 2014, 4:13 pm

Apparently, we don't have a thread for just the Convention Center itself? If we do, and I couldn't find it, feel free to break this off.

Anyway, my little research project regarding the Convention Center funding via hospitality taxes that happened over in the Vikings Stadium thread revealed not only that the Convention Center is a massive cash suck (no surprise there), but also that it owns a little building that it's been renting out as office space for decades, with plans to someday do something cool with.

It's called the Tallmadge Building, and lo and behold, when I searched for it, it turns out that the Strib published a story about it yesterday. What are the odds?

The brick building at 1219 S. Marquette Av., once known as the Hotel Tallmadge, has been owned by the city for 30 years and leased out for office space. But as convention and tourism officials look for new ways to market the city — and prepare for an overhaul of the nearby Nicollet Mall — they say the Tallmadge might be better used as a visitor center...

Without many options for food, entertainment and local information near the Convention Center, Johnson said visitors often stick to the skyways and restaurants near their hotels, rather than exploring nearby destinations like Loring Park or other parts of downtown. He said a facility that could provide information — or even have an amenity like a restaurant — could be an important new feature.

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woofner
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Re: Convention Center Hotel - (330 South 12th Street)

Postby woofner » October 4th, 2014, 10:09 am

I agree with Goodman here. We have poured enough money into the dubious investment of convention business. The city shouldn't be actively working on any uses downtown except affordable housing. That is the one thing needed for a successful downtown that isn't rolling on its own at this point. If a visitor's center must be built, make hotels pay for it and put it closer to the middle of downtown.
"Who rescued whom!"

TroyGBiv
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Re: Convention Center Hotel - (330 South 12th Street)

Postby TroyGBiv » February 15th, 2015, 10:10 pm

It seems like there are a lot of smaller to mid-size hotels proposed in town but the convention hotel is off the radar. The urgency to this seems to have dissolved. Anyone heard anything else on this?

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Munch'n
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Re: Convention Center Hotel - (330 South 12th Street)

Postby Munch'n » February 15th, 2015, 10:25 pm

waiting.....
Meet me in Wells

grant1simons2
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Re: Convention Center Hotel - (330 South 12th Street)

Postby grant1simons2 » February 15th, 2015, 10:31 pm

Just to give some people an idea of how long big projects can take. L&H Station, although it is a multi phase project. Took 6 years of planning. They started in 2008 and then released the project in 2014


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