urbanMSP

The IDS Center is unquestionably one of the Twin Cities architectural masterpieces, but here's a question to ponder: when it was first built, did it damage the urban fabric of Minneapolis more than it helped?

Here's what I mean. The IDS Center didn't include nearly enough underground parking to fulfill the needs of its tenants and visitors. That parking demand had to be met somehow, either by constructing parking ramps or, in those days long before the prohibition on new surface parking ramps, by demolishing existing structures and covering the lot with asphalt.

Moreover, to meet its energy needs, the Energy Center was built at 3rd Avenue and 8th Street. This structure remains one of the greatest eyesores in downtown.

In short, the land area made beautiful by the building itself was probably much smaller than the downtown area uglified to meet its parking and energy demands.

Broadening this thought, is the knee-jerk desire for a tall building over a shorter one as senseless as the knee-jerk reaction against height? My impression is that consideration of the contextual impact of a building is vital, even when the building soars and impresses.

That would have been awesome to see go up. It was just such a tower with nothing to even compare it with. That last picture is so ominous looking. I think that is pretty cool as well.

(Sorry about the comments on older threads today, I need to catch up with some stuff I missed a few weeks ago.)

My Grandma took me there at least once a month during construction and then to the Nankin afterwards!

I suspect that the day the Minneapolis Tribune photographer snapped the pic, there was a temperature inversion which is why the smog was quite dense.

martykoessel - Very well said. I completely agree with context is as equally (if not more so) than the building itself. I think you hit the nail on the head with your comments. At what cost do we have a couple great skyscrapers? I think we have learned (I hope) from the brutal, urban renewal mindset of the 50s-70s and that smart-growth really is the most practical and sustainable way for design. Glitzy skyscrapers are great but if we look at needs of the city, people, businesses, neighborhoods, environment, etc. now that is the key to great design!

I would agree those issues would be a concern if Minneapolis-StPaul were building 30-50 story office skyscrapers all the time. But our cities are not. We haven't had a major office skyscraper in either downtown for ten years. Even the new Xcel HQ building won't even rate as a high rise. I'll endure having to build an extra parking ramp or power station once in awhile if it means we can get a glitzy $200+ million/500+ foot skyscraper every now and then. Tall office skyscrapers don't come around very often in these parts. We should welcome them whenever we have the chance to see one built.

Buildings like the IDS pay millions in property taxes and are home to thousands of highly paid white collar jobs. I'll take that over a bunch of short stubby buildings. Even the new American Academy of Neurology HQ building near the Guthrie was touted as the first new office building built in downtown Minneapolis in a decade. So it's not like we're even seeing smaller office buildings sprouting up left and right. Let's enjoy what gets built whether it's big or small. Sounds depressing. But as much as us folks on this forum love our Twin Cities, we're not a NYC or Chicago.

I had posted these two shots on Minnescraper once upon a time. The first is from 1972. The second is one I took in 2008 from about the same spot.





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Thank you Avian for posting those comparable pics. What a difference 36 years of progress has made. I would like to think, all for the better, as well. I highly suspect that view will dramatically change in the next 15 years. Downtown is poised to see multiple mid-rise and skyscrapers built by then. I truly believe that once the height of the IDS is overtaken by another tower, we'll have multiple towers eclipse it shortly thereafter. Be it, office, hotel or mixed-use. Just my gut feeling.

I love this comparison! Though it does drive me crazy being it features my LEAST favorite surface parking lot. Looks like it's been there a while. Lame.

I want the 1972 Lamp posts back! They look much nicer than the ones we have now although maybe it's just cause they look different. Also thanks for the comments about the impact of the IDS building never really thought of super high buildings creating a "field of cars" It's always refreshing looking at things from a different viewpoint for a bit. Also I wonder if the IDS was never built then could Minneapolis have been a much smaller town? Perhaps a skyline of 10-20 story buildings spread out into the inner suburbs could have existed instead?

IDS is on the market -

http://www.startribune.com/business/163094966.html

http://www.bizjournals.com/twincities/n ... 2012-07-20

"The office space in the main tower is about 95 percent leased, mirroring the tight Class A office market along Nicollet Mall." That's great to read.

Bold strategy to go to market without an asking price.

Interesting read, it doesn't surprise me that the IDS Center is up for sale and that Class A office space along the Nicollet Mall has a low vacancy rate. What I did find the most interesting in the article is that Carlson Companies have their Corporate HQ and Plaza 7 up for sale. Now, they just might have a lease-back arrangement with the new buyers. Or, is Carlson Companies thinking a move to downtown Minneapolis? Perhaps a mixed-use tower with their corporate office and a Radisson hotel located in 1 building (larger version of their Plaza 7)? Or perhaps twin towers, office tower and a hotel tower? That will be interesting to do some follow-up work on. It would make good business sense to locate downtown for a whole host of reasons.

Don't even tease! Carlson Downtown would be insane.amazing.want.

During the fireworks tonight, the lights on the top of the IDS Center were red, white and blue. Is that capability new? I'd never seen them anything but white before.

Yea I noticed that to. I've never seen the top of IDS lit different colors like that.

I seem to recall a convo about them being off for a month and being replaced with LEDs. It was okay, but nothing special.

Yeah they've been off since earlier this year. At least March, for upgrades to LED. They just turned em on last night for the 1st time. Nice to have em back on. Looking forward to what other features they will add. Still hooting for an Eiffel Tower style twinkle/sparkle effect!

I'm hoping, probably in vain, that they start leaving them on all night now, and that the Capella and Wells Fargo towers will follow suit. I'm as much for energy conservation as the next guy, but the skyline looks so cool when those three buildings are lit up, along with the Target building. I think they should be on until bar close at least.

The lights were out for bird migration... seriously. http://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2012/03/0 ... ory-birds/. Also they were installing new LED like the Target building has (but I don't think they can do the art work).

Unfortunately I don't think the big 3 were turning their lights out (originally) as much to save on their energy bill as in response to people's complaints of light pollution.