Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

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Mdcastle
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Re: Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

Postby Mdcastle » June 14th, 2021, 9:43 am

So, if businesses are moving closing anyway, can someone enlighten me as to what incentive they would have to lie and blame the crime problem (or difficulty of parking) instead of just being honest and saying they had lease issues? After all, you do see it all the time where there's signs "Lost Our Lease- Everything Must Go!"

I like to think people are basically honest, unless maybe there's a specific incentive for them to lie.

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Re: Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

Postby EOst » June 14th, 2021, 9:56 am

Right. They're way more likely to lose customers by blaming crime and unrest than by saying "Uptown is too expensive, come visit us on Grand."

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Re: Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

Postby uptownbro » June 14th, 2021, 9:59 am

While some do lie if there business idea fails. But this is not the case. They were successful and have been for 35 years. The cities leaders have more or less left uptown to fend for itself. Lyn Lake is doing fine. While some places have closed ie blue door, muddy waters. There have been new places to open as well to replace them. Lyndale is recovering pretty well. Why is Hennepin struggling. I refuse to believe rent is the only cause for this difference. People are far to entrenched in there political ideals these days and things must fit a certain narrative.

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Re: Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

Postby Silophant » June 14th, 2021, 10:05 am

I'd like to think that too, but the evidence is that many (not all) business owners would prefer to place the blame on anything else rather than admit that their business, or even a single outpost of their business, couldn't make it forever.

The most recent example that comes to mind is I Like You moving from 1st Ave NE to Johnson St. The first interview with the owner said that they were moving because the neighborhood had changed and become too bustling (a nightmare scenario for a gift shop, I guess), but then a few weeks later she admitted it was because their lease was up and the rent was going to quadruple.

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Re: Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

Postby EOst » June 14th, 2021, 10:20 am

The most recent example that comes to mind is I Like You moving from 1st Ave NE to Johnson St. The first interview with the owner said that they were moving because the neighborhood had changed and become too bustling (a nightmare scenario for a gift shop, I guess), but then a few weeks later she admitted it was because their lease was up and the rent was going to quadruple.
I don't think this is the slam dunk you think it is. While good urbanists like us might think those things are unrelated, I think a lot of people would look at those two things and think that they are actually linked.

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Re: Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

Postby mplsjaromir » June 14th, 2021, 10:28 am

Boom Island Brewery guy made up a bunch of stuff when he moved from N Mpls to Minnetonka. It happens all the time, when you've been around the block a few time you know not to take small business owners statements at face value.

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Re: Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

Postby uptownbro » June 14th, 2021, 10:28 am

Agreed. It does happen where its rent related but with the amount of empty retail on this side of uptown I think its bold to assume it can only be rent related. Given how much better lyndale is doing, I doubt rent is that much cheaper a few blocks down given that both are bustling streets.

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Re: Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

Postby tedlanda2571 » June 14th, 2021, 10:40 am

The area is just gonna have to do a full re-set. Rents probably are too high currently, although I have a hard time believing that Juut was staring at a massive rent increase given the condition of the immediate area (although who knows, maybe they had a really long term lease that was way below market by today’s standard).

So I believe them when they say crime and unrest is the discrete cause, but it seems likely that crime and unrest is a bigger factor than it would be if those blocks of Uptown hadn’t done the whole national retailer thing and basically priced the whole area to perfection...

TL:DR Crime/unrest is a real issue, but there are underlying reasons why it’s a bigger issue there than at, say, LynnLake.

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Re: Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

Postby uptownbro » June 14th, 2021, 10:45 am

Well said! It can and imo is both. Rent and crime/unrest together are at play.

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Re: Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

Postby mplsjaromir » June 14th, 2021, 10:53 am

Uptown retail/hospitality might go through a period where national chains and high concept high achieving concepts shun the area. Maybe picks up a bit of punk crust that some feel it once had. The location is too good to be down for long. Houses are still expensive in the area that's for sure.

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Re: Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

Postby tedlanda2571 » June 14th, 2021, 11:39 am

^I think that's basically right. I just worry how long it will take and how bad it will be in the meantime. In my personal opinion, the turning point might be when we see a couple distressed commercial sales, or even a commercial foreclosure or two. That would be a big signal that the model that was tried and failed around Hennepin and Lake has failed and needs a hard re-boot. Basically, it would be an acknowledgement that the underwriting that went into the buildings the last time they sold is no longer valid. Calhoun Square/Seven Points recently traded at a much lower valuation than it's prior sale (if I remember correctly), so that may be the first step...

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Re: Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

Postby xandrex » June 14th, 2021, 12:42 pm

There's a lot of stuff closed in the Uptown area, but what's interesting is that the stretch of Hennepin from Lake to 31st looks better than it has since essentially pre-uprising. A few closed-up places, but decent foot traffic and open businesses not boarded up.

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Re: Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

Postby MattW » June 14th, 2021, 1:22 pm

On a high level, I think what's considered to be the "cool" area of the city is just changing. The change we're seeing now is Uptown to North Loop. 10 years ago, the North Loop was a fraction of what it is today; Uptown had everything. Retail cycles happen, and Uptown will likely have to change a before returning to what it was.

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Re: Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

Postby amiller92 » June 14th, 2021, 3:07 pm

Agreed. It does happen where its rent related but with the amount of empty retail on this side of uptown I think its bold to assume it can only be rent related. Given how much better lyndale is doing, I doubt rent is that much cheaper a few blocks down given that both are bustling streets.
What else do you think is different between the two? Seem pretty similar to me, but there's less parking at Lyn/Lake.

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Re: Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

Postby amiller92 » June 14th, 2021, 3:10 pm

On a high level, I think what's considered to be the "cool" area of the city is just changing. The change we're seeing now is Uptown to North Loop. 10 years ago, the North Loop was a fraction of what it is today; Uptown had everything. Retail cycles happen, and Uptown will likely have to change a before returning to what it was.
Yes and a number of the places that closed in Uptown are brands that were "cool" in the '90s. Brand cycles happen.

Also, regarding Juut, didn't a new salon go in on the 3000 block of Henn in the last two years or so?

ETA: Got by most recent haircut (first professionally since the pandemic) at 48th & Chicago instead of downtown. Patterns of consumption for these services are different right now. And Juut recently closed downtown as well.

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Nathan
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Re: Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

Postby Nathan » June 14th, 2021, 3:25 pm

Re juut leaving...

It seems to me that most of the people living in the uptown area might be going other places. There's a lot more competition now and maybe trendier places. No need for people from the suburbs to come into the city anymore now that they've expanded out there. A sign that denser neighborhoods can support themselves without relying on the burbs.

And from the sounds of the closing letter they're out of step with a lot of people in the community anyways.

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Re: Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

Postby John21 » June 14th, 2021, 3:36 pm

Has there been a massive increase in crime during Juut's operating hours according to their customer's Facebook feed? Also, was there a pandemic?

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Re: Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

Postby grant1simons2 » June 15th, 2021, 7:37 am

Heh, so I hadn't been to Uptown in a while either. I was expecting a ghost town as all of you said. Instead I got families, packed beaches, people put walking dogs, kids playing in front yards, so on and so on. Uptown Cleaners building only had one vacant space out of 10. Lake & Irving still holding strong. Even the frame shop was still there.

Lake/Hennepin/Lagoon fails for one really obvious reason. A horribly unpleasant streetscape. Even with the Hennepin reconstruction, Lake is just so damn big to be able to enjoy time there.

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Re: Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

Postby alexschief » June 15th, 2021, 8:09 am

Yeah, I'm with Grant. The Uptown area wants to feel like a big thriving single retail district, but the truth is that it is cut into about six pieces by some really awful roads and that makes it a miserable experience for casual window shopping. Those three big roads need a massive rethink. Bringing Lagoon and Lake's three car lanes down to one general travel lane, one transit lane, and one bicycle lane would be a huge improvement.

Unfortunately one of the downsides to having a high-end, national-chain-focused retail mix is that they bring a heavy dose of windshield perspective. The story of Uptown in recent years has been a shift away from this "destination retail" model, and there are a lot of people, including landlords, who can't accept that. If you care about the area itself and not any one retailer, there's no reason to worry. Uptown has two key ingredients: people with money and commercial space. It will sort itself out in the medium term.

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Re: Uptown-LynLake-Wedge - News & General Topics

Postby Didier » June 15th, 2021, 8:19 am

Instead I got families, packed beaches, people put walking dogs, kids playing in front yards, so on and so on.
Lol, come on with this.


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