Excelsior and Grand Area - St. Louis Park

[go4guy]

In this area, you MUST have parking. The current Excelsior and Grand developement has parking on the backside, and not on the main road. And it works perfect. As long as the do a nice parking lot, and not a huge one with no landscaping, I think it would work very well.

[mattaudio]

Must? Because of zoning code?

[min-chi-cbus]

It's called a fence. Parking isn't very loud or unsightly, especially behind a fence. Businesses are typically more separated from SFH's than they are to the street.

So is a fence between front-oriented parking and Excelsior Blvd. an acceptable solution?

I'm a bit taken aback that you're defending surface parking in this location. If we want TOD, build TOD.

I mean 10 years ago this area was almost worthless, and now it's gotten hotter (and rightfully so), but change takes time and we're not yet at the point (price point) where parking ramps (or garages, apparently "parking ramp" is a regional dialect thing) uniformly makes sense along this corridor, but I would certainly support them where built or especially when replacing surface parking.

I just don't think surface parking lots are a neighbor's worst enemy, and I have little sympathy for people who move into a preexisting landscape and then demand it change to meet their preferences (assuming the neighbors in this instance are younger than say 70 years old). If given the choice between parking behind the building (and adjacent to SFHs beyond a sight fence) or in front or along the side, I'd choose the former, personally.

[go4guy]

Must? Because of zoning code?

Must. Because a majority of people who would live in this developement would drive a car. Unless you want to damage your bottom line by not meeting the demands of your target market.

[mattaudio]

It's not an issue of must have parking versus must not have parking. It's a matter of degree. How much parking? Hopefully one of our region's most legitimate examples of new urbanism requires less parking than an automobile-dominant land use.

[twincitizen]

Ideally yes...but this development is lacking a key ingredient: transit. It currently has the #12 bus which I assume takes forever and a day to get downtown, even with its limited stop operation between Uptown Station & Franklin. Hell, the 12 doesn't even go downtown outside of peak hours...it ends at Uptown Station, transferring you to the 6 or 17. Probably 45 minutes to downtown on a good day. Being that this site is east of Hwy. 100, it gets screwed out of having any type of express service to downtown. Make the 12 an aBRT line and maybe now you're talking...but that is a conversation that literally no one is having.

*obviously not everyone is going downtown. But the number of jobs accessible by non-car from Excelsior & Grand is pretty limited, period. Damn good local bus service connecting Excelsior Blvd to SWLRT stations could really close the gap, as will the planned P&R at Beltline Station.

[go4guy]

It's not an issue of must have parking versus must not have parking. It's a matter of degree. How much parking? Hopefully one of our region's most legitimate examples of new urbanism requires less parking than an automobile-dominant land use.

True. But a parking lot, done right can still look good. And when the time comes where there is no longer a demand, a parking lot can much easier be converted to other uses such as green space or more housing, than underground parking can.

[David Greene]

Damn good local bus service connecting Excelsior Blvd to SWLRT stations could really close the gap, as will the planned P&R at Beltline Station.

What is it, about 3/4 mile from Excelsior & Grand to the Beltline station? Easily done via bike and even fairly walkable. It's a challenge for the elderly and disabled for sure, but I don't think we need super-frequent fancy bus service here to make the connection.

[Anondson]

Could be its own thread but as this is right next door, the old Bally's lot has a four story proposal. 150+ units.

http://finance-commerce.com/2014/07/opp ... ior-grand/

[twincitizen]

Let's keep it all in one thread. There's something brewing just east of Excelsior & Grand as well, as discussed on the previous page. Not sure we need separate threads for each stick-frame box, particularly when it's more or less an extension of an existing redevelopment area.

[Anondson]

Agreed. I suppose a bit like people's definitions of what uptown is, Excelsior and Grand is that way.

[grant1simons2]

That's on my commute. Always wondering why someone wouldn't snatch that Bally's spot right away. They finally did, awesome.

[twincitizen]

City Pages poking a little fun at E&G: http://blogs.citypages.com/blotter/2015 ... banite.php

[Anondson]

I think this might as well be Excelsior and Grand area, but Oppidan bumped up their proposal for the Bally's site to five stories, was going to be four. Prior proposal was for 150-some units, now 180 units [paywall]

http://finance-commerce.com/2015/01/opp ... s-project/

Still plans for a grocery store.

[bapster2006]

Now 6 (partial) floors (was 4, then 5) and 189 units, with Fresh Thyme. Public look at this April 8, 6:15pm at City Hall. This will be a huge improvement over the vacant Bally's.

http://www.stlouispark.org/webfiles/fil ... ppidan.pdf

[Anondson]

Saw that new photo posted on a SLP history-oriented Facebook page. Threw me for a loop seeing six stories. Everyone but me was complaining "... aaarrrrgh, MOAR apartments!!1!"

I wonder if the city staff had guided them to look to increase units. Excelsior and Grand's entire retail has needed more housing around it.

[grant1simons2]

It's actually an okay looking building for what Oppidan has done in the past. I'd go as far as saying I like it.

[min-chi-cbus]

I like it too but it doesn't fit in with the rest of Excelsior & Grand...like at all. Also, is this project 2 buildings or one horseshoe-shaped building? Finally, why create a space for yet another grocer when Trader Joe's is a block or two away and Byerly's is about a half mile away? I realize all of these tenants will need a place to buy groceries, but since when is an entire Trader Joe's AND Byerly's not enough?

Personally..........I was hoping for a pharmacy, because that's the only thing I think E&G is truly lacking in.

[xandrex]

^Err, doesn't Excelsior & Grand have a CVS?

[Anondson]

Don't forget the groceries at Target, too!