Block E (archive)

[twincitizen]

It was a combination of a poor tenant mix, a bad market and problems at the corporate level for several of the tenants. Then there was Alatus' greed forcing out successful tenants so we'd feel bad for them and allow a casino to ruin downtown Minneapolis.

Applebees and the like fall under poor tenant choices. Why drive downtown and pay for parking to eat at Applebees? Why eat at Applebees downtown when there a dozens of unique, interesting restaurants around that you haven't eaten at 1000x before?

Hooters, Borders and Gameworks all had issues or outright bankruptcy at the corporate level, which also coincided with the recession, but I think all of these places were destined to fail regardless of the economy.

I don't know the exact story with Hard Rock Cafe. At least they stuck around to see Target Field open, but I still don't think they were drawing very well. I think they might have closed against their will. I think a Hard Rock could work in this market, but only at MOA where the tourists are.

The movie theater was FORCED OUT by Alatus, oddly after the casino proposal was already dead. The movie theater went to court to keep their lease, but Alatus wouldn't have it. This one bugs me the most of all.


All these fuddy duddy proposals lead me to think that Alatus is going to float the casino proposal again during the next legislative session. Who knows, they could be making enough money off the parking ramp, Shout House and Keiran's to stay afloat for a while longer. They're probably smart like us and know that the e-pulltabs funding scheme for the stadium is going to implode, so they're just waiting it out.

[Didier]

I'll go against the grain a bit here: Applebees is an unfair scapegoat for Block E.

Sure, it's not very exciting, but the implication that people who live and work downtown are too good for an Applebees is ridiculous. Applebees is an affordable, easy restaurant — the kind of restaurant that's hard to find downtown.

Let's remember that even locally owned downtown restaurants, say Brit's Pub for example, still rely mostly on patrons who live outside downtown. Honestly, Applebees probably served the local population much better than any so-called “destination restaurant.”

And really, you’d be hard-pressed to find any major downtown that doesn’t have an Applebees, TGI Fridays, Chili’s etc. Chicago has a TGI Fridays right off Michigan Avenue!

[Nordeastmpls]

How about simply re-vamping the exteriror, add windows, add a few street level entrances, list it for lease and build out the interior to the new tenants' needs? There you go. Organic city growth. Spruce up the exterior and lease out the space to whatever businesses want to locate there...offices, restaurants, bars, retail, etc.

[John]

In my utopian dream for this block, I wish they would add a very slender residential tower on one corner like the Private Residences at Hotel Georgia in Vancouver. We could use more residents living right in the core of the entertainment district, in addition to adding something striking and contemporary to the architectural mix.

[nordeast homer]

YES!

[Didier]

Was Hard Rock Cafe a part of the purge that saw Applebees, the movie theater and all of the other places in the east side of Block E get kicked out?

It seems like the First Avenue side is unlikely to see significant changes, so if Hard Rock left on its own I really hope something replaces it soon. Block E was never perfect, but now that it's empty it's a huge blight for the area.

[writruth]

John, you may be on to something with your vision of vertical utopian architectural development. During the next three years, thousands of housing units will come on line in the downtown core, North Loop, Mill District and south end of Nicollet Mall. Much of the demand for these units are being driven by the parallel investment in comprehensive public transit, suburban empty nesters wanting to be closer to downtown amenities, and the flow of educated urban professionals who also desire quick access to work sites and urban play centers.

If downtown Minneapolis is to reach the goal of 50,000 residents by 2025, it is inevitable that developers will find it efficient and necessary to grow vertically, especially as surface lots continue to be developed and removed from the marketplace. Competition could be fierce, leading to better and better design outcomes. Businesses in search of smart, educated workers would have an incentive to locate downtown, fueling a cycle of sustained growth.

The early test of this will come in 2-3 years. If the housing units in the current pipeline are snapped up, developers will likely want to build on their success, the emergence of such could spur the utopian skyward development boom many of us on this site would love to witness.

[robotlollipop]

Their goal is actually 70,000 residents by 2025!

[min-chi-cbus]

I still think that for downtown to TRULY attract people (particularly families), it needs to FEEL family-oriented, which means it needs VERY safe and accessible parks. I'm not sure very many U.S. cities do this well, and the only one that I can think of that does is San Francisco.

I don't think we need one giant park like Chicago's Millenium Park or New York's Central Park (or even Pittsburgh's downtown park), but rather, take a half block or block here and there, potentially starting with Block E. Use half of it as either a park or public square/piazza (no grass, no cars) and the other half to do this location right, which includes lots of nighttime activities. Yes, the park/plaza could be used by the seedier peoples of town, but that's really not a reason not to build something IMO -- it can be addressed if need be.

[spearson]

In my utopian dream for this block, I wish they would add a very slender residential tower on one corner like the Private Residences at Hotel Georgia in Vancouver. We could use more residents living right in the core of the entertainment district, in addition to adding something striking and contemporary to the architectural mix.

That thing reminds me of The Nicollet, just a little bit. I like your idea as well and feel residential would be nice right in that area.

[Wedgeguy]

Was Hard Rock Cafe a part of the purge that saw Applebees, the movie theater and all of the other places in the east side of Block E get kicked out?

It seems like the First Avenue side is unlikely to see significant changes, so if Hard Rock left on its own I really hope something replaces it soon. Block E was never perfect, but now that it's empty it's a huge blight for the area.

HArd Rock left because their lease was up and they were no longer pulling in people like they used to. I think they decided to get out and us their resource where they were making better money!

[Aville_37]

I still think that for downtown to TRULY attract people (particularly families), it needs to FEEL family-oriented, which means it needs VERY safe and accessible parks. I'm not sure very many U.S. cities do this well, and the only one that I can think of that does is San Francisco.

I don't think we need one giant park like Chicago's Millenium Park or New York's Central Park (or even Pittsburgh's downtown park), but rather, take a half block or block here and there, potentially starting with Block E. Use half of it as either a park or public square/piazza (no grass, no cars) and the other half to do this location right, which includes lots of nighttime activities. Yes, the park/plaza could be used by the seedier peoples of town, but that's really not a reason not to build something IMO -- it can be addressed if need be.

Agreed! I also always thought building a park on at least part of the existing parking lot behind Glueks and the new dance theater could be cool. I've always hated that parking lot. Of course residential/mixed use would be great here too.

[Didier]

HArd Rock left because their lease was up and they were no longer pulling in people like they used to. I think they decided to get out and us their resource where they were making better money!

That's what I figured. I wish there was more activity in regards to replacing it, since it doesn't appear that space will be affected much by the eventual conversion, no?

[Wedgeguy]

HArd Rock left because their lease was up and they were no longer pulling in people like they used to. I think they decided to get out and us their resource where they were making better money!

That's what I figured. I wish there was more activity in regards to replacing it, since it doesn't appear that space will be affected much by the eventual conversion, no?

I think most are waiting to see what Atlas pull out of their A$$ for a concept to make this work.

[Didier]

But isn't it generally assumed that the First Avenue side (i.e. the hotel and Kierans) will remain largely as is? If Hard Rock left on its own, you'd think the space would be suitable for a new tenant right now.

[Wedgeguy]

But isn't it generally assumed that the First Avenue side (i.e. the hotel and Kierans) will remain largely as is? If Hard Rock left on its own, you'd think the space would be suitable for a new tenant right now.

If they redo the facade, a good portion fo the building that area will have to get redone to have continuity with the rest of the structure. HArd to put fake 1900's facade and euro international style side by side and not have us ripping them to shreds on yet another poor design. They have to get the overall floor flows and design figured out before they know where door and windows are going to be. I'd like to see them make a better entrance up to the second level on the 1st avenue side of things. That little emerency exit door enterance is pathetic.

[Didier]

So is it assumed that Kieran's and the hotel are going to be drastically changed too?

[Wedgeguy]

So is it assumed that Kieran's and the hotel are going to be drastically changed too?

The Hotel I think would go for some sort of upgrade of it's facade. Right now it has on the 2nd, 3rd and 4th floors windows from the lobby of the movie Theater. That part of the facade needs some integrating into the hotel. This is why I stress that the interior flow of the building will have to be decided before they do any outside exterior design. I think that there need to be an integration of the hotel into the flow of E-block.
Keirans I think would have a minimal change. The large bay windows where Hooter's was will probably have to be redesigned. They could try and make Keiran look more like and Irish pub if they were part of the redesign. Not saying that the whole facade has to be matchy match. But there need to be some context for the different facades to work together to invite people into the building. I still think that you can use electronic sign age. But is has to be better integrated into the flow of the facade. Not postage stamps stuck on like the present design. Look to NYC for good sign design!

[robotlollipop]

I still think that for downtown to TRULY attract people (particularly families), it needs to FEEL family-oriented, which means it needs VERY safe and accessible parks. I'm not sure very many U.S. cities do this well, and the only one that I can think of that does is San Francisco.

I don't think we need one giant park like Chicago's Millenium Park or New York's Central Park (or even Pittsburgh's downtown park), but rather, take a half block or block here and there, potentially starting with Block E. Use half of it as either a park or public square/piazza (no grass, no cars) and the other half to do this location right, which includes lots of nighttime activities. Yes, the park/plaza could be used by the seedier peoples of town, but that's really not a reason not to build something IMO -- it can be addressed if need be.

Agreed! I also always thought building a park on at least part of the existing parking lot behind Glueks and the new dance theater could be cool. I've always hated that parking lot. Of course residential/mixed use would be great here too.

hmmm. Considering the demographic that those bars target to, I don't think a park in that location would be the best idea.

[Lancestar2]

I prefer to see the block vacant for 2-4 years as they continue to press the issue for a Casino! ...with a DLF control of state senate and state house and the Gov chair I would assume the negative effects of a casino on the morality of the community would be overlooked enough to see it's a fantastic option!

Other than that I think if the actual owner saw the suggestions to "redo the outside design" of the former Hard Rock Cafe to attract a new tenant I think they would get a good laugh. The casino is the only option to greatly improve the area with more customers and sidewalk traffic and increase demand for hotels and would greatly improve the quality of downtown for visitors.

Now don't anybody start throwing FACTS at me to ruin my dreams for a wonderful downtown!