Red Line (Cedar Avenue BRT)

[Lancestar2]

Apple Valley seeks redevelopment along busway. http://m.bizjournals.com/twincities/mor ... n-its.html

"They also cautioned us not to think that transit would be a magical economic driver."

"We haven't specifically addressed building heights yet," Koegler said. Most likely they would be consistent with existing building heights in the area that max out at about six stories, he added.

One current retail project offers an example of the kind of development and land use that's likely to result from the guide plan, Nordquist said. Two buildings -- one a Chick-fil-A and the other a Smashburger -- will be constructed at 153rd Street and Cedar on a portion of what is now Cub Foods' vast parking lot. The development addresses a key finding of the AIA study that Apple Valley could improve its streetscape in the area by reducing its seas of parking lots

OK... so while aiming low for building heights they are planning to build a few fast food joints with OF COURSE A DRIVE THRU! Into a already "sea of parking lots" With a poor walkway design it could make it worse for walkability. I really am loosing all hope in this project becoming a success... IMO I think a mini 3 stop bus route (MOA, Cedar Grove, Palomino) and a commuter bus from the park and rides would have been a better solution given their concept of the potential of Apple Valley's stations is so low.

A bit off topic but has any big box developer ever tested a store with parking in the back and a short set back from the street where they have space for a nice plaza and maybe a few walk up vendors? Do businesses chains not trust customers would be willing to park in the back of a building? Is there any hope for the future growth of suburban big boxes?

[Tcmetro]

Well, Cedar Grove is cornered by freeways and the parking-riddled outlet mall going in, and Met Council/MVTA/whoever is in charge of the BRT plan decided to skip Palomino despite it having a number of apartment buildings and trailer parks within walking distance.

Of course when we say "BRT" we mean the bus that runs every 15 minutes at the day, 30 minutes evening/weekend, with a sorry excuse for span of service. Hey, and it'll be just like a bus because it will have a farebox, but it's BRT because the wonderful engineers at Dakota County were graceful enough to allow the buses to use the shoulder between the right turn lanes!!! It's a shame no one wanted to pony up the millions of dollars to build that skyway for the 100 riders that will use the 147th Station. Now they are more vulnerable to be hit by a car on the newly widened road as they run for the last bus at 8pm!

Thanks for wasting hundreds of millions of dollars, because a 15-30 minute bus needs a brand new road and a bus shoulder. I couldn't think of a more deserving project.

Sorry for all the sarcasm.

[Lancestar2]

Hey, and it'll be just like a bus because it will have a farebox,

My understanding is that the bus will only have a fare box on the stations just like LRT making both doors enter/exit's decreasing boarding times. Also I really don't think making a skyway above the road is really a good use of money IF they don't have a 2 story building on the other side that would benefit (like a park and ride ramp) making people climb stairs, cross street, descend stairs again is rather silly I think. Even if there is a parking ramp it limits the usage to only park and ride travelers benefiting from the skyway. I wonder if tunnel crossings would have been better with less clearance needed would have been less height change as well as being more of a open space to the elements.

[mattaudio]

http://www.humantransit.org/2012/11/the ... ansit.html

Oh really.

[Lancestar2]

They made the seats red! ...I think they look cute

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid= ... permPage=1

[mulad]

Also very important that the bus has an effing rear door, unlike much of the MVTA fleet. I see the LRT-like interior bike racks too.

[MSPtoMKE]

Yes, and a Go-To card validator at the rear door as well.

[Lancestar2]

Yes, and a Go-To card validator at the rear door as well.

But shouldn't that only be at the stations like with LRT? will they have transit police checking tickets like they do for LRT? seems rather inconstant

[MSPtoMKE]

No, I think it is to make it more consistant with all Metro lines, by having it be proof-of-payment. Some of the stops will have ticket vending machines, but not all. Therefor you will still be able to pay in cash onboard when boarding at a less major stop, but must retain your ticket to show Transit Police.

[mpls_tc]

http://m.startribune.com/news/?id=182912841&c=y so how does this work. Catch a city bus, ride it for fifteen minutes to the mall wait longer for a train going the same direction and sit on that for an additional 45 minutes.

[twincitizen]

Why not include the standard exterior bike rack, just in case? It's not like they're super expensive, compared to the total cost of a bus anyways. I don't think it would negatively affect the running time that much having people put bikes on the outside. It's probably a moot point since so few people will be connecting via bike or riding this line in general.

I don't see the word "Rapid" anywhere on that bus, so I guess Dakota County commissioners can shove their petty opposition to Metro Transit naming aBRT "Rapid Bus".

[mulad]

I'm a bit confused about that too -- the Apple Valley Transit Station has an extra 3rd door for bicycle riders to use to reach the front rack. So you have to use the (in front of the) front door to put a bike on a regular bus, but the rear door to bring a bike on a Red Line bus. Maybe there will be some way to notify passengers about which door to use as the bus approaches, but the lack of consistency with this, the mix of on-line and off-line stations, and the on-board/off-board ticketing is pretty maddening.

Seems like the opening date has slipped -- I thought I'd last heard it would open around February. The Strib article says May or June.

[twincitizen]

http://finance-commerce.com/2012/12/min ... ompletion/ "as early as May"

To promote this line, they should just make it fare-free for several months, if not all of 2013. If riders want to continue on Hiawatha or a bus at MOA they can pay a fare then. It would be a great way to get people that live near the corridor to give it a try and expose them to the station to station aspect of it.

[Tcmetro]

Stumbled across this...

http://metrotransit.org/metro-red-line.aspx

Says it will be a part of the Hi-Frequency network despite the 30 minute frequency on Saturdays.

[QuietBlue]

http://m.startribune.com/news/?id=182912841&c=y so how does this work. Catch a city bus, ride it for fifteen minutes to the mall wait longer for a train going the same direction and sit on that for an additional 45 minutes.

Yep, that's how it will work. It is exactly as pointless as it sounds, and doesn't offer any significant benefit that the current service doesn't already provide.

[Lancestar2]

http://m.startribune.com/news/?id=182912841&c=y

Although some commuters may find it convenient to take BRT to work, the busway will not be geared to them. Minnesota Valley Transit Authority commuter bus service to downtown Minneapolis will continue unchanged.

People will appreciate being able to leave their cars at home and take the busway to the airport and Mall of America or other stores and restaurants along Cedar, Branning said.

The route is not geared for people going downtown! The idea is that it's for suburbian people wanting to go to the Airport and MOA. They do have the option to go downtown via the blue line if they choose but they will be better of taking the express bus downtown to work!

IMO it gives much more flexability to workers in the area say they have to stay late past the express bus times then they have option of taking the blue then red line back home.

[LRV Op Dude]

[BBvideo 425,350]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PnEzqA ... ploademail[/BBvideo]

[QuietBlue]

The route is not geared for people going downtown! The idea is that it's for suburbian people wanting to go to the Airport and MOA. They do have the option to go downtown via the blue line if they choose but they will be better of taking the express bus downtown to work!

IMO it gives much more flexability to workers in the area say they have to stay late past the express bus times then they have option of taking the blue then red line back home.

Again, none of this is a change from the current situation. You can catch a bus to the MOA at least once an hour (all day) as it is. I have done all of these things myself with the current system. The extra frequency is nice, but I would much rather see later hours of operation and more service on feeder routes than something that just duplicates existing service for the most part.

[stp1980]

This is going to be a test. Can the burbs with better transit develop to become a little more like urban areas with more density and walkability?

[mattaudio]

This is going to be a test. Can the burbs with better transit develop to become a little more like urban areas with more density and walkability?

Seems strange that the corridors that have potential for more density and walkability are away from Cedar (Galaxie and possibly Pennock).... at the same time, this project made Cedar even more of a behemoth highway, so it is less friendly to TOD or any sort of walk-up transit use.