Uptown - LynLake - The Wedge - News & General

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I should be clear that 99% of me is thrilled and delighted that the City (perhaps with some nudging from local residents) had the vision to insist on this five-block pedestrian connection. If you advocated for this route, my hat is off to you.

But the 1% little voice in my head that says “wait, couldn’t this be even better?” is the part of me that was motivated to speak up. What’s there already is an amazing improvement over 5 years ago, unless you or someone in your party happens to be in a wheelchair.

I understand your comparison to a private sidewalk at a single family home, but these buildings contain more dwelling units than the average City block, and the private sidewalks to the main entrances of these buildings do meet ADA requirements. Also, this is a 5-block long pedestrian route, which seems to blur the lines between public and private. The sidewalk might meet the letter of the law(or perhaps not, idk), but what about the spirit of the law?

I’m perplexed by your comments about bikes. Do you mean that ADA principles shouldn’t apply, because curb ramps at corners already let bicyclists use sidewalks? To what extent should annoyance about bicyclists determine how accessible a neighborhood is to people in wheelchairs?

And more generally, don’t you thank your lucky stars when you see a reckless person on a bike – or would you prefer that every reckless person was riding in a ton steel with a hundred horses under the hood? I’m guessing we can agree that such folks are least dangerous when walking, which brings me full circle to being so thankful that this 5-block pedestrian connection was built. And thanks again to you or any other readers who had a hand in making this happen!

[xandrex]

It wouldn't even have to be someone in a wheelchair - it certainly doesn't seem to make it any easier to push a stroller along either (though as someone lacking children, I suppose I can't really comment).

[Wedgeguy]

Other than driveway I do not believe there are any curb cut exclusively for any of the apartment buildings. I maybe wrong. I'll be sure to check that out tomorrow when I'm walking thru that area. Other wise from a public safety stand point you are introducing traffic to a section of street where there rarely is ever someone on wheels going out. I know they have special signs at the greenway to make sure that Make sure that driver's are aware that there will be crossing bike traffic ahead. The curbs are the responsibility of the city if they want them in. That is the city portion of the street, THE BOULEVARD, not the responsibility of the private property owner. I'm not sure how much clearer I can make that! To put curb cuts in would mean that the CITY has to put in marked crosswalks and signage in both directions warning motorists of that said crosswalk. That is 6 streets that the city will need to invest money to put up those signs and pay for those curb cuts. I hear people bitch that they have to pay assessment and then we have those that want extra just to satisfy themselves. without having to directly pay for it. Yes, there is a large portion of the biking community that tend to ignore traffic signs, to their own detriment. Also bikes are not supposed to be riding on that sidewalk anyway. That is why we have the greenway! I just say there are not curb cuts for the safety of many that would abuse them and cause a public safety problem.

[David Greene]

Why would the city need to mark crosswalks and signs with curb cuts? There are plenty of unmarked crosswalks in the area.

It does make strollers more difficult to use, especially if you've got one with small wheels. We invested in a BoB urban-land-offroad-warrior vehicle for our little one which makes navigating these things much easier. Great for hiking too!

There definitely should be curb cuts for accessibility but absent that, there ought to be no parking signs around the crossings to improve visibility. There are already bikes on the promenade (and it's not a good thing) so curb cuts aren't going to change much in that department. I'm much more worried about getting squished by a car I can't see than I am about a bicyclist getting hit. The bicyclist is higher up and can see better.

[thatchio]

First, it is fantastic to see the vision implemented. Second, I'd agree that there was a missed opportunity by all involved to not get an even better outcome. curb cuts should have been proposed and required, additional landscaping and set back should have been required on Flux, and some consistency (but not all) should have been encouraged. Hindsight is 20/20 and these projects all come to fruition fairly quickly with budgets that prioritize rent-returns over the bigger picture. But I do think the community was able to get quite a bit leveraging private dollars that funded all of the promenades with the exception of Midtown Lofts, which I think had some TIF back when it was the first project in many years ago.

[Wedgeguy]

The fact that we got this promenade completed in such a short amount of time is fantastic. But I lived with one block of promenade for a few years, the post condo years, before the next two blocks were ever proposed. I don't think the city was even prepared to have this vision filled so fast. I'm one who is very happy with what we DID get and used it quite frequently.
Maybe someone can ask the city to put the curb cuts in and see what the rational was for not including them. I'm be interested in the answer.

[scottiem]

I love this promenade. I would find myself taking the dogs for a walk on it before it was fully completed (and having to take 1/2 block detours to 29th) just cause the feel of it is nice. ADA ramps, along with signage to block parking/raise awareness in their vicinity, would complete the thought and make it a great walking corridor.
In my opinion, fear of people on bikes isn't a valid enough reason to deny access to amenities for the disabled and babies in strollers. Once the the 29th shared space is open, I believe bikers will be drawn away from the promenade anyways.

[MNdible]

All of these bridges are going to have to undergo pretty major repairs soonish, right? I wonder if the city isn't waiting until that time to rework the curbs and grades in these areas, possibly including bumpouts?

[tab]

I really like the idea of bumpouts, to reduce the crossing distance and perhaps provide some space for more green space/wider boulevards. Also, bumpouts would presumably be more effective in restricting parking than signs would - though signs could be installed tomorrow at minimal cost, so they have some advantages too.

[xandrex]

With a project like this, might it even make sense—when reconstructing the bridges/streets/whatever—to keep the street crossing level? Seems like that would have the benefit of 1) providing access for anyone with a disability or stroller, 2) make cars more aware of pedestrians entering the crosswalk, and 3) be a speed table that would slow people down in their cars.

[TommyT]

I love the mini canyon effect we're getting along this stretch of Lake and Lagoon. I'd love to see the Calhoun Square empty lot be 8-12 stories and a signature Uptown tower on the Arby's lot and the rest can be filled with these 4-6 story buildings we've been seeing lately. I think that would really complete the neighborhood.

How old is the Lund's that's there by the way? I doubt it would happen, but I think it would be really great for them to rebuild with underground parking a la whole foods downtown, their store on the first floor and offices/apartments/condo above getting rid of that parking lot.

[twincitizen]

Very old. It's the original Lunds, albeit added on to. Hennepin County says the structure (or the oldest part of it) dates to 1939.

If Lunds could redevelop in a way that would let them keep the store open, like they did for the Southdale location, I'm sure they would do it. That almost certainly isn't possible here, so that's probably what's holding them back. They'd have to close the store for 18 months or more before opening in a new building.

I think someone else floated this idea before, but it would be kinda cool if Lunds took over the Cub spot (in a new mixed-use building ideally). That way there might again be a market for a new Cub store at the Kmart site, as was once intended - before Rainbow dissolved and Cub took over the Dupont location. As for the current Lunds site, that could redevelop sans grocery, turning over to other retail uses and residential.

[Anondson]

Lunds and Byerlys is finishing redevelopment of the Southdale store with apartments. Grocery stores and apartments seem to be a tiny trend. Whole Foods downtown, Whole Foods at Selby-and-Snelling, Southdale Byerlys, old Bally's in SLP, Lennar site on York in Edina was supposed to have a small scale grocery store. Probably others.

So why not!

[min-chi-cbus]

I love the mini canyon effect we're getting along this stretch of Lake and Lagoon. I'd love to see the Calhoun Square empty lot be 8-12 stories and a signature Uptown tower on the Arby's lot and the rest can be filled with these 4-6 story buildings we've been seeing lately. I think that would really complete the neighborhood.

How old is the Lund's that's there by the way? I doubt it would happen, but I think it would be really great for them to rebuild with underground parking a la whole foods downtown, their store on the first floor and offices/apartments/condo above getting rid of that parking lot.

I love density and urban design as much as the next person here, but I'm also okay with some surface parking -- especially at grocery stores. When my parents lived in Chicago's Lincoln Park neighborhood there was a grocery store nearby and it also had a surface lot and it wasn't like a glaring breakup of the urban fabric -- it was actually a nice reprieve from the uber-density that exists especially on Chicago's near-north side. You could also easily transfer your stuff from the store to your car (if you drove) or walk straight out onto the street. Having a large parking garage would actually make that harder, and not having a grocery store would hurt the neighborhood.

I guess I'm just saying these places can exist side-by-side with other more traditionally-urban forms.

[mattaudio]

At many of the dense urban neighborhood groceries I've been to in other cities, the parking lot is a constant shitshow. Sort of like some of the Trader Joe's here. How hard is it to have technology to count how many spaces are full and how many cars are going in or out? The worse I've ever seen is the underground parking for a Trader Joe's in Madison, WI. Entrance/exit at one end, and a dead-end parking arrangement. Anyways, regarding Uptown: Yes, a smattering of surface parking won't destroy a neighborhood. But Uptown still has far too much, in too large of blocks, and without technology or other cues to manage demand, ingress, and egress.

[David Greene]

I think someone else floated this idea before, but it would be kinda cool if Lunds took over the Cub spot (in a new mixed-use building ideally). That way there might again be a market for a new Cub store at the Kmart site, as was once intended - before Rainbow dissolved and Cub took over the Dupont location. As for the current Lunds site, that could redevelop sans grocery, turning over to other retail uses and residential.

OMG I'd be in heaven!

Although I think there's a ton of value in having a less expensive grocery in the area.

[mamundsen]

At many of the dense urban neighborhood groceries I've been to in other cities, the parking lot is a constant shitshow. Sort of like some of the Trader Joe's here. How hard is it to have technology to count how many spaces are full and how many cars are going in or out? The worse I've ever seen is the underground parking for a Trader Joe's in Madison, WI. Entrance/exit at one end, and a dead-end parking arrangement. Anyways, regarding Uptown: Yes, a smattering of surface parking won't destroy a neighborhood. But Uptown still has far too much, in too large of blocks, and without technology or other cues to manage demand, ingress, and egress.

Parking lot car counting technology was installed at the Como Park parking lots. There are signs that now display which lots have space and which are full.

[Wedgeguy]

Very old. It's the original Lunds, albeit added on to. Hennepin County says the structure (or the oldest part of it) dates to 1939.

If Lunds could redevelop in a way that would let them keep the store open, like they did for the Southdale location, I'm sure they would do it. That almost certainly isn't possible here, so that's probably what's holding them back. They'd have to close the store for 18 months or more before opening in a new building.

I think someone else floated this idea before, but it would be kinda cool if Lunds took over the Cub spot (in a new mixed-use building ideally). That way there might again be a market for a new Cub store at the Kmart site, as was once intended - before Rainbow dissolved and Cub took over the Dupont location. As for the current Lunds site, that could redevelop sans grocery, turning over to other retail uses and residential.

The biggest issues with moving the Cub to the Kmart site is that a majority of the neighborhood would not get into their cars to drive to the Cub, when many like me walk there all the time and will not be shopping at LUND'S due to the price point that they charge. The second would be that, they already have a large store less than 2 miles away, with the Hiawatha store that would be cannibalized by having a store so close. So you either cannibalize one of your current locations ,or lose a part of your customer base that will not follow you to the new location.

[FISHMANPET]

But you also said you wouldn't go to Lunds either so would you just not buy food anymore?

[Wedgeguy]

The joy of living in Uptown is all but Cub are over priced. I'd have to wait for friends to take me shopping with them and get my food in bulk unlike hitting the store a few times a week like I do now. Or I would have to get on the 21 bus to go to the store and drag my food back which would be a major pain in the ass. As it is, not everyone in Uptown has a car or the budget to spend money for the likes of Lund's and Kowalski's. The Wedge prices wise is not that much better. I simply put out for discussion two reason that Cub would think twice before making such a move.