urbanMSP

That's true. The stadium really stands out when you're coming north on 35W, even from as far south as Burnsville. This would also be super obvious from that vantage point.

Regarding the 3,000 sf retail space facing W River Pkwy, fine, whatever. I could see it being similar to the space in Lime (LynLake) where it is part lobby, part cafe/restaurant. It's not a lot of space, so it won't be much more than that.

I'd much rather see a retail/restaurant addition to the Padilla office building, replacing the surface parking lot on 11th Ave (facing Gold Medal Park): https://www.google.com/maps/@44.9773997 ... 312!8i6656 You could built a pretty significant one-story addition in front of the office building to give it great frontage on 11th Ave, even while retaining some of the parking lot.

Finance & Commerce on it.

https://finance-commerce.com/2018/03/ry ... iverfront/

Interesting-

The Eleven’s design will differ in the details from the Ryan-designed Estelle towers. The high-profile New York-based Robert A.M. Stern Architects will bring a 1930s Neo-Classical look to the tower, Wanninger said.

“This is not Estelle 2.0,” he said in an interview Wednesday.

Even if Estelle had gone forward, Ryan still would have built the Eleven project, Runck said. “This is a sited project we’ve had our eyes on for quite some time,” he said Wednesday.

Based on that it seems estelle 2.0 could still be coming up somewhere else in the cities?

Based on that it seems estelle 2.0 could still be coming up somewhere else in the cities?

They can pickup the Nicollet Block after the March deadline is blown by United Properties.

Based on that it seems estelle 2.0 could still be coming up somewhere else in the cities?

They can pickup the Nicollet Block after the March deadline is blown by United Properties.

Let's cross our fingers....

If not, the Eclipse block or the West Hotel blocks are open and a strong residential presence on either could help change the perception of Hennepin.

Was there a specific proposal to reuse the Estelle design in Minneapolis? I don't remember if Ryan had a site in mind and I can't find a thread on it.

I don't believe so. They said after Edina shot it down that they would take it somewhere else, then this site changed hands and we all assumed it was for Estelle v2, but apparently it was this all along.

there are so many places...
Literally anywhere in DTNE
Uptown Arbys
West Calhoun
Hennepin county medical examiner
I like the eclipse spot on Hennepin though, what a great way to open into north loop.

As far as the Padilla building goes, Ryan still owns it, and they mentioned that they're working on legally attaching its air rights to the condo tower to preserve its downtown views. Which makes sense, but is a little disappointing. I wouldn't expect another tower directly adjacent to this one or anything, but I wouldn't mind a redevelopment that dumps some of that parking fronting 11th.

I understand why Ryan want to attach the air rights but hopefully it can be done in such a way that allows that office building to be redeveloped at some point, even if it 6 story stick built with great retail along 11th. I would guess once we see the packet for this and how the parking ramp is configured that may give us an idea if that's even on the table.

I'm sure it'll be redevelopable, just not any taller than it is now.

Based on that it seems estelle 2.0 could still be coming up somewhere else in the cities?

A locked Biz Journal article today confirms this, with some quotes from Bernardi. He confirms that they are two separate projects, and Eleven is not "Estelle 2.0". He reiterates that Estelle is a two-tower Ryan-designed project. The Edina site is still the most likely landing spot, either in slightly reduced form or they may just wait out Edina's Comp Plan update to see if it allows greater density on the west side of France (per state law, all metro cities Comp Plan updates are due by the end of 2018). But I suppose there's at least a sliver of a chance it winds up downtown (I can't really see it going anywhere outside downtown or east riverfront, tbh...no precedent for it)

Having said that, despite his claims, you have to figure some of the same developer equity and/or lending source that was going to be used for Estelle is being redirected to Eleven. So I don't really expect Estelle to re-emerge any time too soon, like probably not simultaneously with Eleven, if it's a Ryan-Bernardi project.

Based on that it seems estelle 2.0 could still be coming up somewhere else in the cities?

A locked Biz Journal article today confirms this, with some quotes from Bernardi. He confirms that they are two separate projects, and Eleven is not "Estelle 2.0". He reiterates that Estelle is a two-tower Ryan-designed project. The Edina site is still the most likely landing spot, either in slightly reduced form or they may just wait out Edina's Comp Plan update to see if it allows greater density on the west side of France (per state law, all metro cities Comp Plan updates are due by the end of 2018). But I suppose there's at least a sliver of a chance it winds up downtown (I can't really see it going anywhere outside downtown or east riverfront, tbh...no precedent for it)

Cool good info!

Estelle to St Paul at the old West Publishing/Jail location would be my choice.

That's a pretty great idea. St. Paul condos are in high demand, and it would have enough space for both towers to have amazing riverfront views. And they could probably sweet talk St. Paul into giving them assistance too. Anyone got Bernardi's number?

How would that tower plan work on a site where you have an 8 story drop between the street frontage on one side and the grade on the opposite side of the site?

Also, these are still going to be very high-end condos -- even though the views from the West Publishing site would be jaw-dropping, I'm not really sure that St. Paul can support that many (actual) luxury condos.

Snap! I think you may be surprised.

No snap or snark intended. I honestly don't think the market is there for an all luxury building like Eleven or Estelle to be built in St. Paul. We're not talking about a couple of penthouse units on top of a building -- these proposals are effectively all penthouses.

Entirely possible that I'm wrong, of course.

EDIT: And for the record, I don't think there are many other places in the metro that could support these proposals.