urbanMSP

Huh? How was the greenspace happening without the stadium?

Politically they became connected, but there was absolutely nothing preventing that kind of development and investment when the Metrodome was there. If Minnesota had spent $400 million on the new park and on, say direct subsidies to developers for projects, there'd have been more building than there is now.

Separate the political reality from the economic reality. Stadiums only catalyze development in the former sense.

Previous statements from Wells Fargo essentially said the new parking ramp (which they didn't have to pay for) was probably the main factor in choosing the location. That also happened "because of the stadium" but could have happened at any time if the city had political will to build it.

Judge ruled the city does not have authority to operate The Commons.

http://www.startribune.com/judge-city-o ... 483656801/

It looks like the city and park board are going to appeal.


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Get rid of the Park Board. Problem solved.

One problem they have is that they keep gaining properties to manage through gifts, endowments and other means, yet the people leaving this land don't leave any operating budget so they are constantly running at a deficit and it continues to snowball. They're in charge of a property across the street from my house and it's lucky to get mowed once every 3 weeks; they still haven't mowed this year and the grass is over a foot tall.
Could you imagine the Commons being neglected like that? I'd rather the city stay in control of it.

Are we honestly comparing the integrating of a brand new park to that of a vacant gas station?

Not necessarily, but over the long term they have a history of letting things go without repair and regular upkeep. I'm just glad that they outsourced restaurants at their food buildings because they had a bad track record with that as well.

Not development related, but figured it would be a good place to ask anyway. Does anyone know if you can have a wedding at the Commons? My fiancé and I are are looking at locations to get married next August. I would love to be married here.


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Look here:

https://www.commonsmpls.com/events-landing

New residents can't come soon enough to this area. On an absolutely beautiful Saturday evening I counted exactly zero people in the Commons. I have also heard that the new Wells Fargo building is loathed by the workforce. All the inconvenience of working downtown, with little of the benefit.

There were quite a few people in it when I walked through Wednesday afternoon and they didn't all look like Wells Fargo officer workers.

After 2 years in the Edition building I moved out this month. Similar feelings; outside of the occasional concert at US Bank stadium, it's kind of a dead zone. Felt oddly lonely in the middle of "the city".

So is 5th Street just going to remain as is? Weren't there plans to close the section between the park and tracks to cars?

Some changes have been made to the streets here, but purely to the benefit of cars

You might say,
- After the closure of 5th St between 11th Avenue and Park Avenue as part of the Vikings Stadium (4 blocks), and the $9.79 million project to realign the I-94 offramp to 7th St rather than 5th St.
- AND the elimination of all curb cuts and curb uses of 5th St between Park Ave and 5th Ave S (2 blocks) with the Commons/Edition redevelopment
- AND the lack of continuity for motorists on 5th St S where it is blocked by Government Center Station, AND the lack of a traffic lane north of the tracks on 5th St between 5th Ave and Hennepin Ave (5 blocks)
- AND the lack of comfortable bicycle facilities into the core of downtown AND the newly-created two-way bikeway next to the stadium from 11th Ave / Samatar Crossing to Park Ave at 5th St
- THEREFORE this lane becomes THE PERFECT space for a two-way bikeway that extends existing bikeways on the east side of downtown right into the downtown core near Government Center Station.

But Public Works would say,
- But think of the handful of cars that need to use 5th St S to go from Northbound Park Ave to Northbound 5th Ave who do not want to use 3rd or 7th Streets to make the jog! (Here's data on the usage before the stadium, back when 5th St S actually served the Star Tribune blocks)

5th between the stadium plaza and government center plaza was always good biking because there were few cars, but there's even fewer now that the ramp is closed/being demolished (although the demolition taking up a lane makes it less so).

Cool story, but this park is kind of great and the programming this summer has been awesome. We've lived near gold medal park since 2008 and we've used this park this summer way more then we've ever used gold medal park. Other people are figuring it out as well. Its a great spot.

No one is arguing that it isnt?

Sorry, just a random thought since this thread popped back up to the top.

On topic -- to me, as a frequent user, 4th is easily the most disruptive of the surrounding streets with the 3 lanes of speeding cars. But I assume the least likely to be changed for the better.

It's a really, genuinely pleasant part of town -- provided you didn't drive there. I actually have to basically agree with the WF employees that they don't really get the benefit of the dense core unless they walk a number of blocks. It's a great park, though, and a bit of programming or services (like a cafe) would go a long way to making it come alive.