urbanMSP

Is the train busy after games going downtown?

I've seen long lines for both platforms after a game.

Yep it is. The two people I know that own season tickets go back towards downtown. One couple to get the bus back to South Minneapolis, and the other to go to a Warehouse District bar.

Skyways = A+++ on a week like this.

Monday = snow leads to terrible sidewalks and intersections
Tuesday - Thursday = HOLY COLD!

I don't think anyone disputes that skyways are great when it's -20. The argument is that comfort on those five days is not worth sacrificing the vitality of the downtown for the other 360 days in the year.

I don't think anyone disputes that skyways are great when it's -20. The argument is that comfort on those five days is not worth sacrificing the vitality of the downtown for the other 360 days in the year.

The vitality of downtown is the Skyway system. Our street level is at Level 2. It's an important part of the city's identity.

Let's use projectors to make it look like everybody in the skyway is actually on the sidewalk.

Let's use projectors to make it look like everybody in the skyway is actually on the sidewalk.

Why do you want people to walk on the sidewalk so badly? There's already a thriving pedestrian scene one floor higher.

Because it's thriving for 3 hours a day, 5 days a week (slight exaggeration but you get the point).

Because it's thriving for 3 hours a day, 5 days a week (slight exaggeration but you get the point).

So the goal is to force people to walk somewhere they'd rather not walk, in the hope that you can manufacture a thriving street culture similar to those found on the East Coast? Why not just try to improve the iconic and unique pedestrian system you already have?

Let's use projectors to make it look like everybody in the skyway is actually on the sidewalk.

Why do you want people to walk on the sidewalk so badly? There's already a thriving pedestrian scene one floor higher.

I'm a joke maker.

So the goal is to force people to walk somewhere they'd rather not walk, in the hope that you can manufacture a thriving street culture similar to those found on the East Coast? Why not just try to improve the iconic and unique pedestrian system you already have?

Is this in response to the projector comment? I haven't seen any "tear down these skyways" talk in a long time.

The skyways serve a purpose. The can be improved on greatly. The streets are slowly improving, but are still desolate and windswept and poorly thought out in many locations. These can also be improved on greatly.

Keep the skyways but make ingress/egress 10x easier and I'm sold. The mental barrier of having to find/know where to get in/out besides the IDS is a turn off and more crossing up/down would help both thrive. Hopefully Dayton's can help a bit with this.

I'm an avid and regular skyway user. I definitely walk farther to more things than I would absent skyways.

But they are problematic, in that they are not really public, and thus subject to private gatekeepers, and those same gatekeepers are an obstacle to making ingress/egress easier.

Regardless, they aren't going away, because building owners and tenants like them, so I personally think the best route to is to push to improve them and push back on the gatekeepers.

Some of you may recall that the original plans for Block E had an exterior escalator that would have led directly into the skyway system, located on the face opposite the Target Center. Apparently Minnesota's building code doesn't allow that, and given our nasty weather, probably for good reason. And so instead, we got that terrible connection through a fire stair that exists today.

But anyway, I'm hopeful that the trend is towards better connections between the street and skyway level. Newer buildings, and even renovations, seem to be providing more visible and intuitive access.

I'm so glad I revived this thread today

Like many others, I think we should embrace the skyways. I hope as the downtown residential population grows the skyway hours and access do too. IMO they should be open 24-7-365.

When I was down here for the boat show on Sunday, people were parking in many skyway connected garages and leaving coats, hats, gloves, etc in the car. No need to lug it around the show. We went to lunch after and the destination was "as close to the skyway as possible."

We can keep the skyways, we just need to move like 5-10% of the businesses (primarily fast-casual restaurants and convenience stores) down to the street level. Just 5-10% (that's between 1 in 10 and 1 in 20) of existing skyway businesses would be absolutely transformative to our street-level vitality. I would 100% be on board with a small public subsidy to make this happen.

We can have the best of both worlds, but getting more businesses on the street level of our downtown core is non-negotiable. There are small towns that have more sidewalk storefronts than our central business district! We don't need to "tear down the skyways", but the fact that anyone would actually make that argument shows how serious the problem is.

Give the 5% thing some thought...the city core would feel totally different at the street level. I'm dead serious about the subsidy too.

I'm an avid and regular skyway user. I definitely walk farther to more things than I would absent skyways.

But they are problematic, in that they are not really public, and thus subject to private gatekeepers, and those same gatekeepers are an obstacle to making ingress/egress easier.

Regardless, they aren't going away, because building owners and tenants like them, so I personally think the best route to is to push to improve them and push back on the gatekeepers.

Agreed. Access to the skyways is the biggest issue, coupled with their limited hours. I would like to see more retail/restaurants on the 1st floor, with 200k workers during the day and a growing downtown residential population I would think they could easily be supported.

But anyway, I'm hopeful that the trend is towards better connections between the street and skyway level. Newer buildings, and even renovations, seem to be providing more visible and intuitive access.

I mean, sorta. If you look for it, it's not that hard to find the access from the Nic to the skyway, but it not like IDS or US Bank Plaza or even US Bancorp. ETA: And all of those should have street-level signage so people on the street can know that there are businesses open to them on the skyway level.

Lat45 access is obvious from the skyway, but not so much from the street. I don't think there's skyway access from the new Xcel building. I'll have to go look at 365 Nicollet.

There is public skyway access from the new Xcel building - it's that completely unmarked door about 20 feet from the skyway on the Nic on 5th side. It's never been clear to me what their schedule is for having the door unlocked. (Or why it's not 24-7, given that both the ground floor and skyway level security desk are staffed 24-7)

365 Nicollet also has a similar setup - an unmarked door on the north corner of the building.