urbanMSP

Oh how I wish Hennepin actually happened



http://www.swnewsmedia.com/eden_prairie ... mode=story

What about New Market? It has a solidly intact historic core, but then sprawls out towards Elko.

I would include South St Paul, even though not much remains of the original "core". The city always had a separate identity from St Paul proper. The center of the city was located at Concord and Grand. A local historian even titled her book "The City That Tore Itself Down" - there are some reeeally depressing pictures out there of what used to be

From what I've learned since moving here, the SE Metro along the river was historically overlooked / looked down on as dirty / smelly / etc. The old time locals still hold a grudge. That would include Newport, St Paul Park, and the legacy village of Inver Grove (Concord & 60th-ish)

The northern parts of West St Paul were just St Paul bleeding over the border

I'd pick Prior Lake over Rosemount or Lakeville. Although its downtown is small, they've invested significantly, and I think they have a more cohesive town identity than Savage (probably not more than Shakopee, though). Rosemount and Lakeville seem about equivalent to me. Farmington is distinct because it really had a traditional town form until the 1980s or so.

Plus it gives you a great opportunity to include the contrast of old and new Farmington, best exemplified by the glorious street frontage of the "front" of Farmington High School:



This conversation really emphasizes how arbitrary this all is, though.

I too would say Prior Lake is "in", albeit barely. The downtown main street is only 2-3 blocks, but retains much of the original character shown in historical photos from the 30s and 40s. Also, before current MN 13 was rammed through (and a rail line torn out and replaced with CSAH 21), the grid layout was much more apparent. (From what I've been able to determine, old 13 ran on current 170th Street toward current Duluth Avenue, then turned through downtown on Pleasant Street and Main Avenue before curving into current 160th Street). Also, geographic extent and population figures (1,114 in the 1970 Census, pre-suburbanization) are similar to your downtown Carver minimum example.

Oh how I wish Hennepin actually happened

Hey, if ever the airport outgrows it site for good, I guess something like that isn't beyond possibility. Oslo relocated their airport to Gardermoen around the year 2000, opening up a significant area for redevelopment in an inner-ring suburb on the border of downtown.

It's all dystopian-looking office buildings today, though: https://www.google.com/maps/@59.8989761 ... 312!8i6656

@mulad might have one. Otherwise I've seen an excellent online map somewhere with old alignments -- OpenStreetMap maybe?

Something like this?

http://www.openrailwaymap.org/

ding ding ding that's the one

I'd put Lakeville above PL. The traditional development around the main street isn't as large as Farmington's, but it's much larger and mroe intact than PL. They've also done some decent investment, with a senior apartment building + ground floor retail being the biggest in my mind. Its history being less of a outstate farming community and more significant pull by the metro area (served by passenger rail from Minneapolis) does it for me.

Something like this?

http://www.openrailwaymap.org/

Someone ought to put in all the old TCRT routes.

IMG_0346 by North Star Highways, on Flickr
Towns prominent enough to be on the map in 1922 might be one way of looking at it.

Elk River is another possibility. A few old buildings remain but there's definitely a grid there.