Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Roads - Rails - Sidewalks - Bikeways
BikesOnFilm
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Re: Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Post by BikesOnFilm »

A lot of the complaints from Robbinsdale have been just noise, but I will say it has frustrated me that nobody has suggested putting an elevated walkway over Bottineau and the LRT station. A bridge and elevator are fine when we're talking about Bryn Mawr, we'll elevate a freeway at Bass Lake, but we have to value engineer in a downtown where the population has already been cranky about the project?

Then again, this feels basically like the last municipal consent process for SWLRT. Say you won't agree, get some concessions, hold a 2 hour long meeting where you hem and haw over it, and then it all gets signed anyway. It's almost like this process rewards bad behavior by design.
twincitizen
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Re: Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Post by twincitizen »

thespeedmccool wrote: September 16th, 2024, 12:27 pm The Met Council clarify how many parking spaces are really needed at the Robbinsdale P&R and how that will impact traffic
How about zero? Putting a P&R in downtown Robbinsdale is a stupid idea, and not building one will reduce impacts on traffic because zero cars will be driving to it.
Silophant
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Re: Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Post by Silophant »

Scrapping the Park and Ride would also mitigate the lost taxable land issue, allow the station to be moved back to 42nd to help with the pedestrian accomodations, and drop the total project cost by however much. Sounds like a winner!
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thespeedmccool
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Re: Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Post by thespeedmccool »

thespeedmccool wrote: September 16th, 2024, 12:27 pm Mayor of Robbinsdale announced that the City Council will vote (possibly unanimously) to deny municipal consent. Their specific requests will include that
  • The Blue Line be elevated through Robbinsdale or that "significant" pedestrian accommodations are made
  • The Met Council clarify how many parking spaces are really needed at the Robbinsdale P&R and how that will impact traffic
  • The station at Lowry/North Memorial account for emergency and private traffic operations at the hospital
  • Since the Blue Line will divert traffic to West Broadway through Robbinsdale, the project should include the full reconstruction of West Broadway through Robbinsdale
  • The Met Council should do more anti-displacement work
  • The stations should include turnstiles
  • The Met Council should pay Robbinsdale PILOT funds for lost taxable land along Bottineau
  • The project should include the full reconstruction of two blocks of 40th.
Whole lotta nothing, IMO. Unless the politics of it all scares them off, the Met Council can safely just do some more 'study' on most of this, deny other portions, and throw Robbinsdale a bone by including pedestrian accommodations or whatever at some intersections (which they probably would've done anyway) and maybe commit to finding the funds to help with reconstructing West Broadway (this seems related to Hennepin County's imminent turnback of the road, so I guess Met Council could commit to offer regional solicitation funds for a rebuild.)

What a waste of energy, time, and money this whole process is.
This vote has been delayed due to a letter Robbinsdale got from the project team.

The letter is basically "we've already addressed some of these things, some of things we are planning to address but are not part of municipal consent, and some of these things are not reasonable or not our problem." The letter basically rejects elevating BLX through Robbinsdale, so I guess that's a dead issue unless Hennepin County gets cold feet.

Any other cities on the line considering making a fuss? Minneapolis is pretty enthusiastic, and I think Brooklyn Park is too? What's Crystal up to these days?
Bakken2016
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Re: Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Post by Bakken2016 »

thespeedmccool wrote: September 18th, 2024, 8:33 pm
thespeedmccool wrote: September 16th, 2024, 12:27 pm Mayor of Robbinsdale announced that the City Council will vote (possibly unanimously) to deny municipal consent. Their specific requests will include that
  • The Blue Line be elevated through Robbinsdale or that "significant" pedestrian accommodations are made
  • The Met Council clarify how many parking spaces are really needed at the Robbinsdale P&R and how that will impact traffic
  • The station at Lowry/North Memorial account for emergency and private traffic operations at the hospital
  • Since the Blue Line will divert traffic to West Broadway through Robbinsdale, the project should include the full reconstruction of West Broadway through Robbinsdale
  • The Met Council should do more anti-displacement work
  • The stations should include turnstiles
  • The Met Council should pay Robbinsdale PILOT funds for lost taxable land along Bottineau
  • The project should include the full reconstruction of two blocks of 40th.
Whole lotta nothing, IMO. Unless the politics of it all scares them off, the Met Council can safely just do some more 'study' on most of this, deny other portions, and throw Robbinsdale a bone by including pedestrian accommodations or whatever at some intersections (which they probably would've done anyway) and maybe commit to finding the funds to help with reconstructing West Broadway (this seems related to Hennepin County's imminent turnback of the road, so I guess Met Council could commit to offer regional solicitation funds for a rebuild.)

What a waste of energy, time, and money this whole process is.
This vote has been delayed due to a letter Robbinsdale got from the project team.

The letter is basically "we've already addressed some of these things, some of things we are planning to address but are not part of municipal consent, and some of these things are not reasonable or not our problem." The letter basically rejects elevating BLX through Robbinsdale, so I guess that's a dead issue unless Hennepin County gets cold feet.

Any other cities on the line considering making a fuss? Minneapolis is pretty enthusiastic, and I think Brooklyn Park is too? What's Crystal up to these days?
The only thing I have heard is the Mayor of Crystal is a bit skeptical of the project, but a majority of the city council approves of it.
SurlyLHT
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Re: Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Post by SurlyLHT »

Robbinsdale thinks too highly of themselves.
Tom H.
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Re: Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Post by Tom H. »

SurlyLHT wrote: September 19th, 2024, 1:35 pm Robbinsdale thinks too highly of themselves.
Oh geez, the Minnesota gauntlet has been thrown.
BikesOnFilm
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Re: Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Post by BikesOnFilm »

It is a pretty stark difference from Hopkins, the SWLRT equivalent of Robbinsdale. One can't seem to understand the irony of thinking a train will divide a community already split in half by a highway, the other asked (IIRC) if the train could run straight down their Main Street instead of on the opposite side of a similarly wide road.
Tom H.
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Re: Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Post by Tom H. »

My wife and I had our first apartment in Robbinsdale many years back, and I always felt that Robbinsdale thought of themselves as a small town that just happened to be surrounded by a city, rather than an integral part of that city. Stuff like the noon / evening whistle evokes a farm town more than an urban community. If I recall correctly, they kind of branded themselves as the First Suburb of Minneapolis and seemingly identify themselves in opposition to their big-city neighbor rather than in partnership with them. (This was 15 years ago, so I could be wrong and/or attitudes may have changed.)
Anondson
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Re: Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Post by Anondson »

As a Hopkins resident I believe that ask back then was to at least investigate a Mainstreet route.

Were one proposed, there could not have been room for driving nor (most importantly) parking.

Businesses wailed heavily when the current redesign dropped a handful just to put in the shitty corner bump outs. So the final design cut some out to not reduce parking too much. Stupid car brain businesses.

Plus I don’t think there could have been a Mainstreet station that could fit.
BikesOnFilm
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Re: Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Post by BikesOnFilm »

Good context. Yeah, I don't think it would have worked to have a mainstreet route, but what a difference in mindset.
Korh
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Re: Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Post by Korh »

The I have noticed more and more business on mainstreet adopting some temporary patio seating at the expense of parking so maybe when the street is scheduled for a redesign they might be more open to less parking but that's a discussion from a different time and thread
Silophant
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Re: Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Post by Silophant »

Municipal Consent from Minneapolis passes out of committee on a 5-1 vote, despite Vetaw's best efforts to kill it on behalf of the subset of her constituents that she cares about.

It also appears that the Washington/Broadway station will be added, though probably without adjusting the other station locations, unfortunately.
Joey Senkyr
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Re: Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Post by MNdible »

Silophant wrote: September 26th, 2024, 9:13 pm It also appears that the Washington/Broadway station will be added, though probably without adjusting the other station locations, unfortunately.
Smart people will have different opinions on this, but I think the proposed station locations are probably the best option.
Wezle
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Re: Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Post by Wezle »

One added location won't make or break the line. I do think that it's smart to future proof things as North Loop will probably continue to creep up Washington over the next couple of decades. All but guaranteed with another station there.
SurlyLHT
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Re: Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Post by SurlyLHT »

Silophant wrote: September 26th, 2024, 9:13 pm Municipal Consent from Minneapolis passes out of committee on a 5-1 vote, despite Vetaw's best efforts to kill it on behalf of the subset of her constituents that she cares about.

It also appears that the Washington/Broadway station will be added, though probably without adjusting the other station locations, unfortunately.
Vetaw lives a block or so from the LRT line and is the Councilperson who will realize it's impacts the most. Ellison is maybe 6 blocks off of it.
Tom H.
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Re: Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Post by Tom H. »

Blue Line LRT extension clears critical step despite opposition

Robbinsdale and Crystal voted to give municipal consent during meetings Tuesday night.
Bakken2016
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Re: Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Post by Bakken2016 »

Tom H. wrote: October 2nd, 2024, 8:11 am Blue Line LRT extension clears critical step despite opposition

Robbinsdale and Crystal voted to give municipal consent during meetings Tuesday night.
Robbinsdale voted 3-2

Crystal voted 5-2

Minneapolis votes today, and I'm expecting a 11-2 vote.
Wezle
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Re: Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Post by Wezle »

Minneapolis vote today was unanimous from city council. Even Vetaw voted in favor!

Municipal consent is over now, next step: finalizing designs for the route through 2025. I wonder if they'll be able to stick to the schedule and begin construction in 2026?
angrysuburbanite
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Re: Blue Line Extension - Bottineau LRT

Post by angrysuburbanite »

Glad to see it move forward!
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