Hennepin Avenue Reconstruction (Douglas to Lake St)
-
- US Bank Plaza
- Posts: 710
- Joined: June 1st, 2012, 9:56 am
Re: Hennepin Avenue
Except the buses were part of that back up. We're not taking about removing lanes; we're talking about giving transit priority in certain lanes
-
- Moderator
- Posts: 1064
- Joined: May 31st, 2012, 11:38 am
- Location: SOUP: SOuth UPtown
Re: Hennepin Avenue
Well, I mentioned removing lanes. Things have a way of working themselves out. It may take a year or two to normalize congestion back down to normal levels, so a construction project may not be the best way to judge a road diet. Also, when this construction occurred, I doubt bike facilities that anyone from my mom to an 8 year old were put in to provide another option for people. Temporary road projects probably don't get people to switch modes either. With a permanent change, many people may decide that they'd rather hop on a bike or catch up on their emails/Facebook on a bus than be stuck sitting in their car. I'm not saying everyone will quit driving, but other modes may be attractive enough that we'd see a significant switch.
As for the comments that people would just switch to Lyndale, this may be true, but who says we can't bring people friendly improvements there as well?
As for the comments that people would just switch to Lyndale, this may be true, but who says we can't bring people friendly improvements there as well?
-
- IDS Center
- Posts: 4615
- Joined: December 4th, 2012, 11:41 am
Re: Hennepin Avenue
Isn't it fun when people are told what they should have in their own neighborhood by other people who don't live there?
-
- US Bank Plaza
- Posts: 710
- Joined: June 1st, 2012, 9:56 am
Re: Hennepin Avenue
Resorting to, "I live there I know better" isn't argument. But since that's criteria we're using, I live half a block off Hennepin
- FISHMANPET
- IDS Center
- Posts: 4233
- Joined: June 6th, 2012, 2:19 pm
- Location: Corcoran
Re: Hennepin Avenue
If you have to live there to know how something works, then how can anybody speak on the Kennilworth corridor, since nobody lives there?
-
- IDS Center
- Posts: 4615
- Joined: December 4th, 2012, 11:41 am
Re: Hennepin Avenue
I'm not saying that people who don't live there shouldn't put forward their ideas. But they shouldn't just dismiss things that residents say about their experiences. For some reason people seem to think we can just eliminate two lanes of traffic on Hennepin. I am saying, as someone who lives in the area and drives and walks on Hennepin practically every single day, that that is not going to work. Biking isn't practical for many of the people driving. Bus improvements would help but we do need to handle a good traffic load here.
-
- Stone Arch Bridge
- Posts: 7761
- Joined: June 19th, 2012, 2:04 pm
- Location: NORI: NOrth of RIchfield
Re: Hennepin Avenue
We have limited right of way. Are we going to sacrifice all modes of transportation for the sake of giving priority to space-inefficient automobile users? Or will we make more efficient uses of this scarce public resource?
-
- Wells Fargo Center
- Posts: 1777
- Joined: May 31st, 2012, 8:02 pm
- Location: Chicago (ex-Minneapolitan)
Re: Hennepin Avenue
Well for the record, I believe that most everyone hear is referring to converting a parking lane into a peak hour bus lane, not taking one of the traffic lanes for a bus lane.
Re: Hennepin Avenue
Hennepin serves the region both as a transportation corridor and as the primary artery of a major commercial district. There's plenty of reason for lots of non-residents to give a hoot.
I also think it's reasonable to acknowledge that you can't just ignore ~30,000 vehicles worth of daily traffic. Many of these trips are probably commuters from near-SW suburbs. Getting them on to 394 (if coming from downtown) or on to transit should be a goal. Easier said than done, of course.
I also think it's reasonable to acknowledge that you can't just ignore ~30,000 vehicles worth of daily traffic. Many of these trips are probably commuters from near-SW suburbs. Getting them on to 394 (if coming from downtown) or on to transit should be a goal. Easier said than done, of course.
-
- IDS Center
- Posts: 4672
- Joined: July 21st, 2013, 8:57 pm
- Location: Where West Minneapolis Once Was
Hennepin Avenue
Before Hwy 12 become 394, and TH 100 and 36th in SLP had its stop light removed, Hennepin and Lake had epic congestion in the 1980s. Anything today is milder in my comparison.
-
- IDS Center
- Posts: 4615
- Joined: December 4th, 2012, 11:41 am
Re: Hennepin Avenue
I never said non-residents shouldn't comment and that they don't have a stake. What I said was that when residents tell you your idea won't work, it's rude to ignore their input and continue to tell them what their neighborhood should look like. At least acknowldge their critiques and try to address them rather than simply saying, "no, you're wrong."Hennepin serves the region both as a transportation corridor and as the primary artery of a major commercial district. There's plenty of reason for lots of non-residents to give a hoot.
I also think it's reasonable to acknowledge that you can't just ignore ~30,000 vehicles worth of daily traffic. Many of these trips are probably commuters from near-SW suburbs. Getting them on to 394 (if coming from downtown) or on to transit should be a goal. Easier said than done, of course.
I am the first one to promote road diets, returns to two-way operation and so on to make traffic calmer. I would fight for two-way restoration on 26th, 28th Lagoon and Lake. But Hennepin won't work with two lanes of traffic. It just won't.
Peak-only bus lanes where the parking currently is *might* work. I am certainly willing to explore that idea. But eliminating two lanes of traffic entirely is a DOA idea.
-
- IDS Center
- Posts: 4615
- Joined: December 4th, 2012, 11:41 am
Re: Hennepin Avenue
It would be interesting to see a study of this. The only non-Minneapolis people I can imagine taking advantage of Hennepin for their commute is some people in far-eastern St. Louis Park and *maybe* some people in far northern Richfield. I have a suspicion the vast majority of traffic is within Minneapolis, at least during peak.Many of these trips are probably commuters from near-SW suburbs. Getting them on to 394 (if coming from downtown) or on to transit should be a goal. Easier said than done, of course.
-
- Stone Arch Bridge
- Posts: 7761
- Joined: June 19th, 2012, 2:04 pm
- Location: NORI: NOrth of RIchfield
Re: Hennepin Avenue
For people driving cars. For people walking, biking, or riding transit it would work better.But Hennepin won't work with two lanes of traffic. It just won't.
-
- IDS Center
- Posts: 4615
- Joined: December 4th, 2012, 11:41 am
Re: Hennepin Avenue
No, it wouldn't. Hennepin is actually pretty good for pedestrians. Any improvement would be marginal and would result more from improving the street frontage of buildings than anything else. It is already pretty good for buses and parking-lane bus lanes during peak could improve that. Maybe it would improve for biking (I am doubtful) but really, just take Bryant of Humboldt or any of the many streets that are much better for biking.For people driving cars. For people walking, biking, or riding transit it would work better.But Hennepin won't work with two lanes of traffic. It just won't.
I'd really rather not have a traffic jam of idling cars polluting my home, thank you very much.
Have we forgotten how many people on this very board said, "I can't wait until they open that turn lane by the library?" One eighth-of-a-block right-turn lane.
Last edited by David Greene on April 20th, 2014, 9:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- FISHMANPET
- IDS Center
- Posts: 4233
- Joined: June 6th, 2012, 2:19 pm
- Location: Corcoran
Re: Hennepin Avenue
Do you mean to say you wouldn't want them in your... back yard???
Of course I kid.
Of course I kid.
-
- Stone Arch Bridge
- Posts: 7761
- Joined: June 19th, 2012, 2:04 pm
- Location: NORI: NOrth of RIchfield
Re: Hennepin Avenue
What good is a transit improvement if it costs less than $1.5 billion?
-
- IDS Center
- Posts: 4615
- Joined: December 4th, 2012, 11:41 am
Re: Hennepin Avenue
Christ, they're still cleaning up the soil from the last ridiculous transportation planning nightmare in the area!Do you mean to say you wouldn't want them in your... back yard???
Of course I kid.
-
- Stone Arch Bridge
- Posts: 7761
- Joined: June 19th, 2012, 2:04 pm
- Location: NORI: NOrth of RIchfield
Re: Hennepin Avenue
PRT? Bob's Transit Revolution? Gondolas?Christ, they're still cleaning up the soil from the last ridiculous transportation planning nightmare in the area!
Edit: I jest. Don't take me too seriously this eve, David.
-
- Stone Arch Bridge
- Posts: 7761
- Joined: June 19th, 2012, 2:04 pm
- Location: NORI: NOrth of RIchfield
Re: Hennepin Avenue
So we cannot build our way out of congestion, but David's concern is valid: Congestion on urban streets causes pollution that affects neighbors. Any ideas out there to solve it? I guess removing cars altogether would solve it (and I have that idea) but it's not politically feasible to remove through-traffic from Hennepin. Congestion pricing on a city street would be much tougher to implement than on freeways. What other options are there?
-
- IDS Center
- Posts: 4615
- Joined: December 4th, 2012, 11:41 am
Re: Hennepin Avenue
Fair enough.PRT? Bob's Transit Revolution? Gondolas?Christ, they're still cleaning up the soil from the last ridiculous transportation planning nightmare in the area!
Edit: I jest. Don't take me too seriously this eve, David.
I'm referring to the one-way pairing of Emerson and Dupont through the Wedge. I don't know when it was changed back to two-way but I've had neighbors tell me they've had to clean up soil contamination.
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: mulad and 4 guests